CSCS - Aug 9 @ TMP, Cayuga

[krazykoncepts]

JRP Presents: CSCS - Xtreme Tuner Challenge

Sat. Aug. 9 2008
11:00am - 11:00pm
Toronto Motorsports Park, Cayuga

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e165/krazykoncepts/CSCS_4x9_F.jpghttp://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e165/krazykoncepts/CSCS_4x9_B.jpg
Spectators
$20 (Includes Free Parking & Pit Pass)

Drag Racing
Heads Up: $50
Test & Tune: $40

Open Lapping
$100 Pre-Registered (Park Admission Additional)
$130 @ the track if spots are available (Park Admission Additional)

Time Attack (Includes Open Lapping)
$120 Pre-Registered (Park Admission Additional)
$150 @ the track if spots are available (Park Admission Additional)

Show & Shine
$15 Pre-Registered (Park Admission Additional)
$20 At the track (Park Admission Additional)
$10 Pre-Registered for clubs of 5+ (Park Admission Additional)

Drifting
$60 Must Pre-Register (Park Admission Additional)

[Fobio]

I'm quite interested in this...anyone else?

[WhiteSpeed3]

yup i will most likely be there

[Fobio]

can someone elaborate on the lapping format and time attack as well?

can't find any specifics of the day from CSCS...

[mleblond]

looks like a good day of fun :)

[mleblond]

can someone elaborate on the lapping format and time attack as well?

can't find any specifics of the day from CSCS...

Time attack http://cscs.ca/content/view/43/68/
"Drivers will then get 3 laps (1 warm up, 3 timed, and 1 cool down) which the driver will attempt to set the fastest time."

Rules for both available here: http://cscs.ca/content/view/46/111/

[krazykoncepts]

can someone elaborate on the lapping format and time attack as well?

can't find any specifics of the day from CSCS...

we have not finalized the schedule yet but the road coarse will run something like this

12:00 - 1:30 open lapping
1:30 - 1:45 drift eliminations round 1
1:45 - 2:45 open lapping
2:45 - 3:00 drift eliminitations round 2
3:00 - 4:00 time attack
4:00 - 4:15 drift eliminations round 3
4:15 - 5:15 open lapping
5:15 - 5:30 drift semi finals
5:30 - 6:30 open lapping
6:30 - 645 drift finals
6:45 - 8:00 open lapping

the time attack segment is run with only 3-4 cars on the track at a time. Drivers are given one warm up lap, three timed laps, followed by a cool down lap. With only 3-4 cars on the track you should not catch up to anyone during your timed laps and if you do we will allow you to run again

the open lapping is run just like any other track day

any other questions?

[Fobio]

thanks guys...this looks real good...

so $120 for Time Attack w/ lapping...

when does pre-registration end?
how much is park admission in addition to the $120? what about my passenger?

[WhiteSpeed3]

admission for drivers is usually $35 and $20 for passenger/spectators

[krazykoncepts]

Park admission is $20 per person....no difference if your a driver or passenger (its just a spectator pass)

[krazykoncepts]

thanks guys...this looks real good...

so $120 for Time Attack w/ lapping...

when does pre-registration end?
how much is park admission in addition to the $120? what about my passenger?

pre-registration ends when its full...registration opened friday that just passed and we have about 20 of the 55 spots taken

[mleblond]

Hey Fobio let me know if you register for the time attack. I will figure it out by the end of the week If I come to toronto :)

[Fobio]

Hey Fobio let me know if you register for the time attack. I will figure it out by the end of the week If I come to toronto :)

For sure man!...I should know in a few days too...

[1flycdnM3]

I plan to go drag racing that day if i am not working. I haven't taken the "3" out to an event yet, so time to break the cherry. Hope I get my clutch in by then (shocks too!)

Actually I haven't been to TMP in 3 years since my accord died so I need the practice anyways :)

[Unoriginalusername]

how many cars are on the track for the open lapping?

[Unoriginalusername]

when do you have to do the instructor ride along part? each time or just at the begining?

[mleblond]

when do you have to do the instructor ride along part? each time or just at the begining?


Usually they have an instructor drive you on your first session, then have one drive along and then your free to go. But I could be wrong.

[krazykoncepts]

Usually they have an instructor drive you on your first session, then have one drive along and then your free to go. But I could be wrong.

Usually thats what happens, if drivers feel that they are still uncomftorable then someone can ride along with you more laps.....most of the drivers out there are willing to shed light on driving lines and take you out as well

[alhope34]

I really want to go to this, but I am also very nervous as it would be my first event. Who/when/where would I pay to enter, I guess I'd go for the lapping/time attack.

Would anyone want to do a pre-meet and ride in with me for moral support?? lol.

[Unoriginalusername]

what is the policy if it rains?

[silvermist99]

For sure man!...I should know in a few days too...

no hada then ?

how is TMP? is it harsh on the car like dunnville?

helmet required?

[Fobio]

no hada then ?

how is TMP? is it harsh on the car like dunnville?

helmet required?

dang...gotta miss HADA anyway...got a wedding on Aug 8, so 11AM on Aug 9 sounds better...

I've never been to Cayuga, but it's a flat track and all flat tracks are tough on tires...esp ones with long straights...tough on brakes too, but Cayuga is prolly a higher speed course than Dunnville.

Helmet always a good idea...

[p_k]

will be there...
cayuga is a ok course,,,,

i personaly prefer mosport or shannoville

[silvermist99]

dang...gotta miss HADA anyway...got a wedding on Aug 8, so 11AM on Aug 9 sounds better...

I've never been to Cayuga, but it's a flat track and all flat tracks are tough on tires...esp ones with long straights...tough on brakes too, but Cayuga is prolly a higher speed course than Dunnville.

Helmet always a good idea...

I'm tempted to go.

krazykoncepts: How do we preregister? so its $140 for time attack w/ one driver. Is open lapping part limited to 55 cars also? ie will it be packed.

uou: rain or shine the race is on.

[krazykoncepts]

I'm tempted to go.

krazykoncepts: How do we preregister? so its $140 for time attack w/ one driver. Is open lapping part limited to 55 cars also? ie will it be packed.

uou: rain or shine the race is on.

rain or shine the road coarse is a go

Yes its $140 for time attack w/ one driver but you pay $120 prepayed and $20 at the front gate.

Its the open lapping cars that are limited to 55. If you register for time attack you are automatically enrolled into the open lapping segment.


Helmets are highly recommended and a must if you choose to get timed laps

[mleblond]

anyone have a plan of the course with all the turns and such? still debating on coming...

[Fobio]

I can firm up this after the wknd for Aug 9...hopefully there'll still be room...

I'll tell you this...I didn't track last wknd...and not tracking this wknd, and I'm one grumpy camper...I'm jonesing...

[silvermist99]

I can firm up this after the wknd for Aug 9...hopefully there'll still be room...

I'll tell you this...I didn't track last wknd...and not tracking this wknd, and I'm one grumpy camper...I'm jonesing...


I'll likely come. How do we prepay krazyconcept?

need to go helmet shopping first...

[silvermist99]

anyone have a plan of the course with all the turns and such? still debating on coming...

http://www.torontomotorsportspark.com/raceway/road_circuit_info.html ? a combination of those probably

[Big Dad]

All of your questions should be answered at http://www.cscs.ca/ You will not need a helmet for lapping, but will need one for the "time attack" portion. The track is not that abrasive and it is by far the best "import" event in Canada, I strongly recomend it to all. Let us make a strong Mazda presence. See you all there. I recomend that you preregister because the road course tends to book up fast and it is great fun.

[silvermist99]

Hey Fobio let me know if you register for the time attack. I will figure it out by the end of the week If I come to toronto :)

im not fobio but im 90% in :D preregister ends tonight.

[Fobio]

OK...really looking forward to this now! I'll see you all there!

[silvermist99]

I signed up also. watching you tube videos now on track layout.

[Fobio]

I signed up also. watching you tube videos now on track layout.

link?!

[silvermist99]

link?!

search for toronto motorsport park on youtube there are lots of them.

here is an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYcjQ_o17_Q

the two straights are going to murder my brakes :bang

[laksman91]

seems like a very fun event if you've got a decent car.. me i've got a stock 3.. no point spending 130 on that.. might as well put that towards a CAI

[silvermist99]

seems like a very fun event if you've got a decent car.. me i've got a stock 3.. no point spending 130 on that.. might as well put that towards a CAI

stock mz3 is fine for other tracks like mosport DDT where not much power is required. A $130 lapping day will likely make you drive your car faster than spending $130 on a CAI.

I'm driving a stock car also :) I rather spend mod money on driving skills to make my car go faster.

[mleblond]

OK im going. Need to register...who do I talk to? Website doesnt have a form or anything :(

[Fobio]

OK im going. Need to register...who do I talk to? Website doesnt have a form or anything :(

Matt...hit one of the PayPal links...I'm sure it's still open man!

http://cscs.ca/content/view/88/122/

[mleblond]

money sent...hope im good. Thanks Fobio.

[1flycdnM3]

bah nobody wants to go on the track and all my friends have plans this weekend so I am out. I don't fully agree that spending $130 on track lapping is a "good way to spend money to go faster" but more "money well spent to have fun in your car"

After all, lapping has no "real world value" to it as you cant do it anywhere else except on the track (which is it's major appeal) so i would just assume spending $130 on an intake to be alot more "practical" because it has every day use.


... Just my $0.02

[MSMitch]

bah nobody wants to go on the track and all my friends have plans this weekend so I am out. I don't fully agree that spending $130 on track lapping is a "good way to spend money to go faster" but more "money well spent to have fun in your car"

After all, lapping has no "real world value" to it as you cant do it anywhere else except on the track (which is it's major appeal) so i would just assume spending $130 on an intake to be alot more "practical" because it has every day use.


... Just my $0.02

I think the money well spent on track days refers to learning the limits of your car in a safe, controlled environment. Learning how to use what you've got (be it stock, or modified to high hell). These would have VERY real life applications as the speeds at many tracks are not that much above regulated speeds. How to look ahead, how to shift, how well your car brakes, corners, etc.

An even more important investment would be proper instruction (either at the track, or a dedicated driving course - especially advanced defensive driving courses, etc) but I digress...

Hey don't get me wrong, my CAI has given me MANY hours of delight on my regular drives home, but some of the driving courses I have taken in the past have come in handy when you REALLY need them - in emergency, potentially life-threatening situations (the truck wheel that falls off right in front of you in the 401, the deer that runs onto the ice-slicked 400N, the turkey who pulls in front of you mid-turn on a road)...

To each their own right? :bana

One last thought, wasn't it Pirelli or some other tire company that said "Power is nothing without control" and "It's not how fast you go, but how WELL you go fast"

[Unoriginalusername]

i've never tracked any of my cars but its always looked fun... but $130 plus a set of pads and rotors, tire wear and any other potential broken/wear items like the clutch etc. scare me out of it as i don't have the money sitting around to bail myself out trouble if it happens. like they say, gotta pay to play so for now i think i will just watch lol

[MajesticBlueNTO]

i've never tracked any of my cars but its always looked fun... but $130 plus a set of pads and rotors, tire wear and any other potential broken/wear items like the clutch etc. scare me out of it as i don't have the money sitting around to bail myself out trouble if it happens. like they say, gotta pay to play so for now i think i will just watch lol

sell me your car and i'll drive it like it was meant to be driven :chuckle

[1flycdnM3]

sorry, but I still disagree as I have learned everything i could possibly know about how my car handles, how good the brakes are and anything else i needed to know without spending $130 on lapping (not taking into account the $400+ i would need for new tires), but to each their own i guess.

UOU, you would very unlikely do any rotor or clutch damage (provided they teach you well), but your pads may take more wear than normal, but they aren't too expensive anyways. I just don't want to buy new rubber, which is more than likely i will need to.

[Unoriginalusername]

sell me your car and i'll drive it like it was meant to be driven :chuckle

make an offer :chuckle :gone

[silvermist99]

sell me your car and i'll drive it like it was meant to be driven :chuckle
make me an offer also! I will include saturday's admission with my car :) 08 ms3 gt w/ leather bolsters, 3500 miles, freshly polished & waxed a week ago.


sorry, but I still disagree as I have learned everything i could possibly know about how my car handles, how good the brakes are and anything else i needed to know without spending $130 on lapping (not taking into account the $400+ i would need for new tires), but to each their own i guess.

UOU, you would very unlikely do any rotor or clutch damage (provided they teach you well), but your pads may take more wear than normal, but they aren't too expensive anyways. I just don't want to buy new rubber, which is more than likely i will need to.

Sorry, I disagree with your disagreement as well IMO don't believe you can predict how your car will handle in any situation without safety pushing the car in a controlled timed enviorment first. One thing autocross taught me is how to look ahead and instant respond time since every course is different. If you are racing someone on the street or anywhere, you might have beaten your opponent's reaction time not their driving skill. To each their own I guess, I like to race against the clock not the loser lining up revving beside me trying to proof that he spent more mod money on his car than me or something.

But yes tracks like tmp where there are two high speed stops will likely kill your pads & rotors + tires after a few events. Instructional defensive driving school is a better way to explore the car's limits without abusing it as much (then lapping) and more useful in real world driving situation. They train you on skidpad, reaction time, looking ahead, traffic flow, sudden manuvers etc.

[silvermist99]

i've never tracked any of my cars but its always looked fun... but $130 plus a set of pads and rotors, tire wear and any other potential broken/wear items like the clutch etc. scare me out of it as i don't have the money sitting around to bail myself out trouble if it happens. like they say, gotta pay to play so for now i think i will just watch lol

try autocross! me & fobio will probably go in late August. You only rip the car for 40 seconds or so 6 times. Its not that harsh.

[Big Dad]

I will be participating on the road course, I hope to see a few more speeds than just me and Vlad like last time. I have done a couple of track events and the stock speed rotors and pads are not any worse for wear. They were designed tough.

[Big Dad]

If tires are your concern I have a set of used Falken Azentis 17X225x45 for $200 if you want.

[mleblond]

so how many already signed up?

1. mleblond
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
....

[Fobio]

1. mleblond
2. Fobio
3.
4.
5.
6.

[mleblond]

did you receive a confirmation from cscs Fobio?

[WhiteSpeed3]

i will be there but on the 1/4 mile cuz i got a some beef to settle with an STi


1. mleblond
2. Fobio
3. Whitespeed3 (1/4 mile)
4.
5.
6.

[silvermist99]

1. mleblond time attack - quite done up
2. Fobio time attack - quite done up
3. Whitespeed3 (1/4 mile) - quite done up
4.silvermist99 time attack - stock

thats it I think?
I'm going to be the slowest mazda there :D

matt: no confirmation, just a payment receipt from paypal. What are we supposed to do with that?? I'm guessing we just print that, give it to the people at the gates and hope they know what to do.

[mleblond]

1. mleblond time attack - quite done up
2. Fobio time attack - quite done up
3. Whitespeed3 (1/4 mile) - quite done up
4.silvermist99 time attack - stock

thats it I think?
I'm going to be the slowest mazda there :D

matt: no confirmation, just a payment receipt from paypal. What are we supposed to do with that?? I'm guessing we just print that, give it to the people at the gates and hope they know what to do.

yeah i guess we are in the same boat. I know Vlad is going too so thats at lease 5 speeds :) Been a while since the last time I attended a speed meet :chuckle

oh and silvermist99 we are all stock :gone

[Fobio]

yeah...I just og PP receipt to show...

and, I'm the 2nd most/least stock...hehe...

[silvermist99]

yeah i guess we are in the same boat. I know Vlad is going too so thats at lease 5 speeds :) Been a while since the last time I attended a speed meet :chuckle

oh and silvermist99 we are all stock :gone

remember to take the r compound off then :chuckle

[mleblond]

remember to take the r compound off then :chuckle
Hahaha my secret weapon :chuckle

[Fobio]

the r's will put matt in a different class...thank goodness...hehe...

[mleblond]

the r's will put matt in a different class...thank goodness...hehe...


That sux, my tires make me super street FWD. Im soooo dead lol


BUT if they put Cobalt SS and SRT-4's in super street i think you guys will get moved up with me :chuckle

[silvermist99]

the r's will put matt in a different class...thank goodness...hehe...
Just me u & MPS in street class then? but i think he has coilovers and probably some crazy tires.

I want a stock class :(

STREET CLASS
The street class has been designed for your traditional stock or slightly modified vehicle which
sees daily driving.
- Vehicle must be registered for use on public roadways. Vehicles entered into Street Class must
show proof of current registration to CSCS officials.
- All Street Class vehicles must use DOT street tires with a UTQG tread wear rating of 140 or
higher, Tires with UTQG tread wear rating under 140 are not permitted in Street Class
- OEM Doors, quarter panels and roofs must be kept in place.
- Front under tray cannot go rearward past the center-line of the front axle
- Rear under tray cannot go forward past the center-line of the rear axle
- No Fender Flares or Wide-Body Kits
- No Suspension that utilizes remote reservoirs unless the reservoir is integrated to primary
dampener body
- No 3-Way Adjustable Dampeners
- Two-Way Adjustable dampeners are ALLOWED
-Passenger seat cannot be entirely removed.

SUPER STREET CLASS
The Super Street Class has been designed for vehicles that are a bit extreme for the street; they
often see more track time then street driving.
- All Super Street Class vehicles are permitted to use DOT Approved tires with UTQG tread wear
ratings of 50 and above. Tires with less than a UTQG rating of 50 are not permitted in Modified
Class.
- Full under trays are allowed
- Wide Body Kits are Allowed
- Passenger seat may be removed entirely.

[mleblond]

MPS runs 615's, my tires are rated 100 UTQG. But keep reading where they class the vehicles. The speed is nowhere to be found but Im sure they will automatically put you in super street with the stock 263hp....

[silvermist99]

MPS runs 615's, my tires are rated 100 UTQG. But keep reading where they class the vehicles. The speed is nowhere to be found but Im sure they will automatically put you in super street with the stock 263hp....

it says mazda: all models quailfy for street class. 263hp isn't alot I don't think. Most midsize sedans & SUV have more. If you look at the laptimes from last event, they put a 911 in street class rwd :chuckle

[mleblond]

oh well, I will have to wait and see what kind of cars show up!

[1flycdnM3]

should I bring up the point you are worried about being "the slowest mazda there" because i do recall you earlier saying that "mods are not important" or something along those lines?!?!

If you are so "good" and "mods are not important" then shouldn't you be excited to beat them and teach them this theory of: experience on the course > what mods you have?!?!

but i digress...

[silvermist99]

should I bring up the point you are worried about being "the slowest mazda there" because i do recall you earlier saying that "mods are not important" or something along those lines?!?!
It is sort of along those lines but not really, notice the “:D” in front of slowest mazda there. When I wrote “:D” I really mean it looking forward to the event. I am not worried and will be fine w/ running the slowest time out of the 5 ms3 that will be there. I rode in and driven Fobio’s car before at autocross and I know how much better his car turns, brakes & go. It is better performance aspect wise then my stock car in everything. Fobio being one of the lighter modded ms3 there on Saturday I know MPS & melblond’s car is completely capable of out gunning, out turning and out braking mine. Also seen the way Vlad drives, im not going to attempt to kill myself & my car to keep up with him lol, especially when I know its physically not possible.

Saturday will give me a good idea on what mods can improve time at track when I can compare my stock car to theirs. The MS3 being such a new platform on the market, not much info available from online community and tuners compare to other platforms I’m used to (vw, nissans). I feel the need to gather data & experience myself.

My method of going faster is tune the driver/driving feel of the car first, work from there and add/remove/change mod accordingly and continue running timed events to see progress.


If you are so "good" and "mods are not important" then shouldn't you be excited to beat them and teach them this theory of: experience on the course > what mods you have?!?!
but i digress...

I do not have experience at Toronto Motorsport park, only been to ¼ mile. But yes I am excited you got that part right. I am going to have fun, learn about my car & my peer’s. Don’t plan on teaching any theories; I will leave that to the older experienced tuners and racers there. I am just an inexperienced 23 year old who loves car & only drove 2000 ish miles on my ms3 since I bought it in March. I am still new to the Mazda world and see Saturday as an excellent way of bonding with my ‘new’ stock car.

Mod plays a huge part on going fast, to me and strictly me only throwing the most parts onto a car does not necessary make it best for me.

IE. I’m not willing to put cobb springs on car even if I get them free, stock MS3 are known to blow shocks and putting stiffer springs on them might prematurely wear them out even faster. I also to happen to drive elders occasionally and I think the way the car is now is about as stiff as they can take. Nobody has a high mileage MS3, only time will tell whether mod like these is reliable or not. I will mod the car when I have more confident in me & the aftermarket mazda tuners.

My goal eventually is to run along with the best street class fwd while keeping the car as comfortable daily driver, not excessively loud, and totally reliable. We’ll see how it goes but so far this car seems pretty promising other then the turbo smoking & engine mount. I’m sure I will eventually find this balance. For now, the first step of tuning my car is getting to know it on the track first.

**edited a couple things sorry.

[mleblond]

I'm just there to have fun!

Anyone know if you can have a ride along with you?

[WhiteSpeed3]

hey guys just woundering if anyone wants to pre meet and cruise down together, i will be meet a couple of the protege guys at dixie and aimco tims at 9AM

1. whitespeed3
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.


pm me if u guys need my cell # so we dont take off on anyone if your running late

[mleblond]

Looks like ill be coming from the markham area, Fobio and silvermist99. Did you guys want to premeet at young and 401? i think the dixie meet is out of the way...

[Big Dad]

Yes you can have a passenger on the road course.

[silvermist99]

Looks like ill be coming from the markham area, Fobio and silvermist99. Did you guys want to premeet at young and 401? i think the dixie meet is out of the way...


I will just see you guys there! Gotta do a few things in the morning all over GTA first.

[silvermist99]

Toronto is showing 80% pop tomorrow :(

cayuga is 40% http://www.theweathernetwork.com/weather/caon0128

pleeeeaaaseeee don't rain. On the other hand if it rains my tires will wear less :D

[WhiteSpeed3]

hopefully it wont rain cuz then its just a wait of gas for me

[mleblond]

lol rain or shine I'm gonna have fun :) I think I may have a good advantage if it rains though :chuckle

Rain on 1/4 mile doesn't work well....BUT normally the track dries up quicker than a normal street pavement

[1flycdnM3]

lol rain or shine I'm gonna have fun :) I think I may have a good advantage if it rains though :chuckle

Rain on 1/4 mile doesn't work well....BUT normally the track dries up quicker than a normal street pavement

not sure about other tracks, but TMP has dryers (machines that dry the pavement) so it quickens the process. however, it has to actually stop raining to use them :)