Sponsor Shameless Ads In Threads

[RedRaptor]

TM3 Mods,

I am tired of sponsors with their shameless spam ads in threads where we are trying to have a discussion on technical information. I understand Sponsors "run" the forum as money talks. However, its so stupid that there is always posts like "We have 10 in stock now." or "Offering cheap oil with free filtes".

No one cares! If a customer wants a product, they will find it in the Sponsor section.

Not to mention that each sponsor has a GIANT signature that spams your screen while trying to browse a thread.

Maybe this is the reality of a maturing forum. Or maybe we need stricter rules on sponsor spam.

Either way, its getting annoying.

[hit26k]

Not to mention that each sponsor has a GIANT signature that spams your screen while trying to browse a thread.

So I'm not the only one who thinks this after all!

I've been informed on more then one occasion to "downsize" my signature because it doesn't abide to the forum rules. Shouldn't a sponsor be treated the same way?

[Default User]

I've been informed on more then one occasion to "downsize" my signature because it doesn't abide to the forum rules.

mine was simply deleted

[S.F.W.]

We will discuss signature sizes with sponsors. If there is a particular offender or two please pm me .

[midnightfxgt]

What's the official size? Mine's probably small enough :)

[cwp_sedan]

mine was simply deleted

Maybe it needed to go on a diet? :chuckle



With regards to signatures, normally most members and sponsors have been good. We aren't too anal regarding some that may slightly infringe on the size restrictions. Like Ami said, if there are any that are blatantly bothering you, PM him or another moderator and we can look into it. :)

[cwp_sedan]

What's the official size? Mine's probably small enough :)

Yours is fine John.


The signature image size should be 600 by 150 pixels or 39.1 KB (whichever is smaller). Some have lines of text instead or sometimes even both. Having the full size image (600X150) and text puts you over the limit.

Signatures should be pleasing to look at.

[FoXy]

what about meee?

[hit26k]

Guys, lets not forget about RR's original post. I was simply adding to his comment. Didn't mean to take this away from his original concern.

[FoXy]

I'd like to know who specifically he is aiming at. Otherwise how will we all know, and how will they know. Fair is fair, I, as a member would like to know.

Most of the time I just ignore these threads/posts because I am tired of all the people on here kissing ass, and trying to sell you anything and everything at the "best price".

[cwp_sedan]

what about meee?

Yours is 1 line of text too large, but unless it becomes a REAL problem with everyones, I'm not going to be on everyone's ass


I'd like to know who specifically he is aiming at. Otherwise how will we all know, and how will they know. Fair is fair, I, as a member would like to know.

Most of the time I just ignore these threads/posts because I am tired of all the people on here kissing ass, and trying to sell you anything and everything at the "best price".

Does it even matter? It's better to generalize so that it applies to everyone. Typically if you are a member/sponsor and something is causing a problem or a member doesn't like something specifically, I'm pretty sure it will be vocalized in one way or another.




Guys, lets not forget about RR's original post. I was simply adding to his comment. Didn't mean to take this away from his original concern.

Most definitely. Don't think I overlooked it. :)

[FoXy]

Does it even matter? It's better to generalize so that it applies to everyone. Typically if you are a member/sponsor and something is causing a problem or a member doesn't like something specifically, I'm pretty sure it will be vocalized in one way or another.


I think it kind of matters because how will sponsers know they are doing something wrong if no one tells them. Part of the problem is that for all the RR's out there who hate it there are just as many (pardon my french) dick riders who cant get enough of said sponsers.

I am tired of it being a popularity contest... and that is EXACTLY what it has become over the last couple years.

[Default User]

Mine's probably small enough :)

LOL

[optiklenz13]

Mine's probably small enough :)

LMAO, John.

[MPS]

im just going to come out and say it G16 FTW

[Booostin]

email all the sponsors its not that hard

[The Wolf]

I think it kind of matters because how will sponsers know they are doing something wrong if no one tells them. Part of the problem is that for all the RR's out there who hate it there are just as many (pardon my french) dick riders who cant get enough of said sponsers.

I am tired of it being a popularity contest... and that is EXACTLY what it has become over the last couple years.

I agree somewhat... But on the other hand, I understand that people are happy to help out those companies who treat them right. I've had one bad sponsor experience on here, and I let people know my experience. I think it's on fair that I do that when I have a good experience too.

[DumpInfo]

Does it even matter? It's better to generalize so that it applies to everyone. Typically if you are a member/sponsor and something is causing a problem or a member doesn't like something specifically, I'm pretty sure it will be vocalized in one way or another.

+1


I think it kind of matters because how will sponsers know they are doing something wrong if no one tells them. Part of the problem is that for all the RR's out there who hate it there are just as many (pardon my french) dick riders who cant get enough of said sponsers.

I am tired of it being a popularity contest... and that is EXACTLY what it has become over the last couple years.

I disagree with you simply because the OP was address by Ami and that's more than enough to resolve the problem. I don't see the purpose of everyone knowing I think it's more gossip people feed on in the forum and somethings are better left unsaid. If the rules were adjusted then I feel the admin should take it from there to notify all sponsors/members if needed.


im just going to come out and say it G16 FTW

:chuckle no shame vlad, no shame...

[cwp_sedan]

im just going to come out and say it G16 FTW

It's easy to point fingers when your own sig doesn't meet the size requirements lol. :P


Please fix it Vlad.

[rick@garage16.ca]

if anyone has problems with my posts plz PM me or email me about it

thanks

[RedRaptor]

I don't have an issue with any of the sponsors on the board. 99% of my business goes towards TM3 sponsors as I understand they help to keep the board up and runnning.

I am under the impression that if a customer wants a product, they will do their due diligence to find the right sponsor.

We don't need sponsors spamming every other post (especially the ones where there is some good technical information being shared) with posts directing newbies to their store front. Treat your customers right and word of mouth is more powerful than you think. Look at Jimmy/StreetPerformance. He has NEVER posted yet everyone directs business to him because they have a good personal experience with his services.

Spamming posts with ads devalues not only your store front but also the product you are trying to sell.

[loki]

I don't have an issue with any of the sponsors on the board. 99% of my business goes towards TM3 sponsors as I understand they help to keep the board up and runnning.

I am under the impression that if a customer wants a product, they will do their due diligence to find the right sponsor.

We don't need sponsors spamming every other post (especially the ones where there is some good technical information being shared) with posts directing newbies to their store front. Treat your customers right and word of mouth is more powerful than you think. Look at Jimmy/StreetPerformance. He has NEVER posted yet everyone directs business to him because they have a good personal experience with his services.

Spamming posts with ads devalues not only your store front but also the product you are trying to sell.

Agreed, yet sometimes members don't have a clue who is selling what (if they don't do their due diligence and research), however, that's where the PM function is such a useful tool.

I don't see anything wrong with a sponsor reading a post, knowing they can help out, and then sending the person a PM saying hey I have what you want if you're interested.

[S.F.W.]

If someone posts asking about a specific product, or products, say Koni shocks. The poster is asking some technical questions prior to purchasing, etc. I see no problem with the sponsor posting up, and stating they can source the product, or have the product in stock if you are interested.
However, if the discussion is purely technical or comparing products, the mod team can get involved if a sponsor is advertising, but not contributing to the discussion.

[MPS]

i have an app for that :chuckle



If someone posts asking about a specific product, or products, say Koni shocks. The poster is asking some technical questions prior to purchasing, etc. I see no problem with the sponsor posting up, and stating they can source the product, or have the product in stock if you are interested.
However, if the discussion is purely technical or comparing products, the mod team can get involved if a sponsor is advertising, but not contributing to the discussion.

[Pyro]

If someone posts asking about a specific product, or products, say Koni shocks. The poster is asking some technical questions prior to purchasing, etc. I see no problem with the sponsor posting up, and stating they can source the product, or have the product in stock if you are interested.
However, if the discussion is purely technical or comparing products, the mod team can get involved if a sponsor is advertising, but not contributing to the discussion.

if a person asks "where can i buy this" then i feel a sponsor can say they have it in stock. I think the issue RedRaptor has is, for example: A person asks "How do I install this?" or "is brand XX better then brand YY" and a sponsor will respond I have brand ZZ in stock. Having it in stock is not really relevant to - how to install, or if certain other brands are better. They are essentially soliciting business.

However it would make sense if a sponsor says "Maybe Brand ZZ is a better choice because it has this and this advantage over brand XX and brand YY . If you are interested you can pm me since I have Brand ZZ in stock"

that would make it relevant. I've seen more then one sponsor simply go "i have this in stock" because they know people interested in that item will click on the thread, and then see they can buy it from said sponsor.

[mazdabetty]

if anyone has problems with my posts plz PM me or email me about it

thanks

Yeah otherwise he'll edit your public posts so he doesn't look bad... :whoa

[cwp_sedan]

Yeah otherwise he'll edit your public posts so he doesn't look bad... :whoa

Quit being a shit disturber.

[mazdabetty]

:P:gone

[peterm15]

I can see two sides of this coming from a forum that DOES NOT allow this kind of stuff at all, sponsors don't get their own thread, are not allowed to discuss what they have for sale outside the public classifieds. As well as coming from a business owner.

There are a number of sponsors on here that do it as well as members doing it for dealers and sponsors. Especially people doing it for Jimmy. I know he's great and all but I'm pretty sure Jimmy and street performance are the most popular terms on this board. Salesmen on here do it as well. ( and no not just one ) With good reasoning. As a business owner to tell someone on a public board you carry an item or have it in stock is just common sense. That's how money is made, for the business and this board.

For example, I'm pretty much a noob. I have been told publicly and privately who carries what item by the specific sponsors. All three I WILL deal with. 2 I already have. If they didn't comment on a post saying they stocked something I wouldn't look. But that's just me.

This forum is basically a huge advertisement for the small companies that support it. I'm pretty sure everyone can handle a few post a day by these people who keep it alive and shoot us some good deals in the process. if you can't. There is a block feature.

Thanks.

( I didn't mean to be rude, it just came out that way)

[n00bMeiSter]

I don't have an issue with any of the sponsors on the board. 99% of my business goes towards TM3 sponsors as I understand they help to keep the board up and runnning.

I am under the impression that if a customer wants a product, they will do their due diligence to find the right sponsor.

We don't need sponsors spamming every other post (especially the ones where there is some good technical information being shared) with posts directing newbies to their store front. Treat your customers right and word of mouth is more powerful than you think. Look at Jimmy/StreetPerformance. He has NEVER posted yet everyone directs business to him because they have a good personal experience with his services.

Spamming posts with ads devalues not only your store front but also the product you are trying to sell.


I agree 100%. It's soo tacky and annoying when they do that. Plus, it makes them look desperate, like they're dying for sales... I will gladly go out of my way to get that same product from another sponsor, I'll go to someone who doesn't harass us with posts like that.

[n00bMeiSter]

If someone posts asking about a specific product, or products, say Koni shocks. The poster is asking some technical questions prior to purchasing, etc. I see no problem with the sponsor posting up, and stating they can source the product, or have the product in stock if you are interested.
However, if the discussion is purely technical or comparing products, the mod team can get involved if a sponsor is advertising, but not contributing to the discussion.

Ami, that is the whole problem. They are asking for information about a product before buying, they aren't asking "Hey who has this in stock?". The sponsors should keep their soliciting to their section of the boards. If they want to pm the person and say "hey, I've got that product in stock when you're ready to buy", then fine (but even that gets annoying fast, too). But they shouldn't be trying to sell items in threads where someone is asking for information prior to purchase (unless they are also asking where they should buy from in the same thread). And this is exactly what happens. Of course, the sponsors also do it in purely technical comparision / review threads, which shouldn't happen either.

Edit:
Straight from the Sponsors Rules and Code of Ethics:

4. Sponsors will only be able to advertise in their section of the Forums. Specific advertising of a product is prohibited in all other sections of the forum. Group Buys conducted by a Sponsor will be restricted to the Sponsor’s section of the Forum.

5. If a member posts a question about certain product availability outside of your forum you may respond by indicating to them by way of a post that you have those items and direct the poster to review your section of the forum.

[Mitchell3]

I agree as well. Sponsors already get their own section to post in about their products and services. That luxury shouldnt carry out over the whole forum. We all already see their threads constantly popping up in the whats new list anyway lol.

[cwp_sedan]

Ami, that is the whole problem. They are asking for information about a product before buying, they aren't asking "Hey who has this in stock?". The sponsors should keep their soliciting to their section of the boards. If they want to pm the person and say "hey, I've got that product in stock when you're ready to buy", then fine (but even that gets annoying fast, too). But they shouldn't be trying to sell items in threads where someone is asking for information prior to purchase (unless they are also asking where they should buy from in the same thread). And this is exactly what happens. Of course, the sponsors also do it in purely technical comparision / review threads, which shouldn't happen either.

Edit:
Straight from the Sponsors Rules and Code of Ethics:

4. Sponsors will only be able to advertise in their section of the Forums. Specific advertising of a product is prohibited in all other sections of the forum. Group Buys conducted by a Sponsor will be restricted to the Sponsor’s section of the Forum.

5. If a member posts a question about certain product availability outside of your forum you may respond by indicating to them by way of a post that you have those items and direct the poster to review your section of the forum.


I don't see a problem with sponsors occasionally mentioning a product in a thread if the question is valid to the pertaining topic or post. Even if the topic is technical and then someone asks "where can I get X product?", what is the harm of the sponsor coming in and suggesting to buy from their shop/store? It's no different than you suggesting to the member to go and buy it from a sponsor's shop or even Canadian Tire.

Now if a sponsor jumps into a topic, for example that is strictly comparing 2 products and instead of giving technical information decide to give the recommendation to buy it at their shop or that they carry this product, then that should forbidden. You are trying to make things black and white by posting the Sponsors Rules and Code of Ethics, but it's not that simple.





I just want to remind everyone that when things are strict on the board, people complain about how much of a pain in the ass the moderators are for enforcing everything. When things get a little laxed, people complain about how the rules aren't being applied to everyone all of the time. Which is it people? lol.

Things are not always easily decided as a black and white issue. If they were, there wouldn't be any question in regards to the rules, etc.

The rules and regs are to be followed but are mostly guidelines. We need to have a set of rules to start with and decide what needs to be addressed and how it needs to be addressed depending on the situation.

[loki]

I think the forum environment is quite well balanced,.

think the OP just just got a bit irritated, decided to post and now here we are.

at the end of the day, who cares?

Great forum, great sponsors, great way to waste a shit ton of time.

[cwp_sedan]

Great forum, great sponsors, great way to waste a shit ton of time.

:chuckle

[n00bMeiSter]

I don't see a problem with sponsors occasionally mentioning a product in a thread if the question is valid to the pertaining topic or post. Even if the topic is technical and then someone asks "where can I get X product?", what is the harm of the sponsor coming in and suggesting to buy from their shop/store? It's no different than you suggesting to the member to go and buy it from a sponsor's shop or even Canadian Tire.

Now if a sponsor jumps into a topic, for example that is strictly comparing 2 products and instead of giving technical information decide to give the recommendation to buy it at their shop or that they carry this product, then that should forbidden. You are trying to make things black and white by posting the Sponsors Rules and Code of Ethics, but it's not that simple.


This is somewhat akin to telemarketers. Do you enjoy having telemarketers phone you and annoy you? No. Do you enjoy having them call you all through out the day trying to sell you duct cleaning, new windows or roofs, or asking if you want to sell your home? Heck no. We're trying to have discussions about things and they're trying to push their products onto us. If it's once in a while, then fine, but it's getting out of hand. Like RR said, stop trying to advertise constantly and let word of mouth do it's work. They'll end up with more customers that way. Point and case - Jimmy. Not a SINGLE post from him, and he's probably the most recommended mechanic on here.

If a sponsor wants to contribute to the technical discussion going on, then fine, but don't come in and just say "I have those in stock, come by tonight." I can't really get into this more without singling out a couple sponsors, so I'm going to refrain.
Now if the person asks "where can I get this?" then maybe, but once one sponsor jumps on it, none of the others sponsors seem to be willing to chime in and it becomes one-sided. And we all know who jumps on it first. Let the community give the person suggestions. No one likes pushy sales people. And it's totally different Ryan, I'm not a sponsor, I'm not trying to be pushy and get sales. I'm a third party (who isn't making money off of it) giving them options and letting them choose whether to go to CT or Sponsor X, without being/feeling harassed or feeling obligated to buy from me.

But it really is that simple. They don't need to post anything unless someone asks where it can be purchased.

Yes we do need to find a balance between lax and strict. And this is one way that we find that balance. Once things get out of hand people will step up and say something, and balance is restored.

I think that the constant advertising in threads needs to stop.

[cwp_sedan]

This is somewhat akin to telemarketers. Do you enjoy having telemarketers phone you and annoy you? No. Do you enjoy having them call you all through out the day trying to sell you duct cleaning, new windows or roofs, or asking if you want to sell your home? Heck no. We're trying to have discussions about things and they're trying to push their products onto us. If it's once in a while, then fine, but it's getting out of hand. Like RR said, stop trying to advertise constantly and let word of mouth do it's work. They'll end up with more customers that way. Point and case - Jimmy. Not a SINGLE post from him, and he's probably the most recommended mechanic on here.

If a sponsor wants to contribute to the technical discussion going on, then fine, but don't come in and just say "I have those in stock, come by tonight." I can't really get into this more without singling out a couple sponsors, so I'm going to refrain.
Now if the person asks "where can I get this?" then maybe, but once one sponsor jumps on it, none of the others sponsors seem to be willing to chime in and it becomes one-sided. And we all know who jumps on it first. Let the community give the person suggestions. No one likes pushy sales people. And it's totally different Ryan, I'm not a sponsor, I'm not trying to be pushy and get sales. I'm a third party (who isn't making money off of it) giving them options and letting them choose whether to go to CT or Sponsor X, without being/feeling harassed or feeling obligated to buy from me.

But it really is that simple. They don't need to post anything unless someone asks where it can be purchased.

Yes we do need to find a balance between lax and strict. And this is one way that we find that balance. Once things get out of hand people will step up and say something, and balance is restored.

I think that the constant advertising in threads needs to stop.

Telemarketers?? Your comparison is invalid since telemarketers do not pay for you to enjoy this community. Sponsors do.

Dave, from now on, you can fund the forum and I promise to keep all posts from sponsors in their proper sections all of the time. Sound good?



I just said earlier all of what you just described above. I don't agree with this type of commenting so I don't understand why you are just reiterating what I and others have said.

You are a third party but if everyone suggested one sponsor all of the time, then no other sponsor is going to be able to get a word in, and therefore possibly lose sales. This is a business to them remember. While being respectful to the rules and members, they still need to advertise in a way that isn't intrusive to everyone.

I don't buy from anyone I don't want to. If you get my money, you are they better option. Simple as that. If you are feeling pressured, then you need to grow a pair and be a little more less influenced by others.

If only it were that simple. In most cases it's straight forward but in some cases things get intertwined and need to be cleaned up.

There is a lot less advertising going on now than there was in the past so I think we are better off than before. Do I think it could still be refined? Yes. With that said I encourage people to report these occurrences so they can be dealt with/cleaned up.

[n00bMeiSter]

Telemarketers?? Your comparison is invalid since telemarketers do not pay for you to enjoy this community. Sponsors do.

Dave, from now on, you can fund the forum and I promise to keep all posts from sponsors in their proper sections all of the time. Sound good?



I just said earlier all of what you just described above. I don't agree with this type of commenting so I don't understand why you are just reiterating what I and others have said.

You are a third party but if everyone suggested one sponsor all of the time, then no other sponsor is going to be able to get a word in, and therefore possibly lose sales. This is a business to them remember. While being respectful to the rules and members, they still need to advertise in a way that isn't intrusive to everyone.

I don't buy from anyone I don't want to. If you get my money, you are they better option. Simple as that. If you are feeling pressured, then you need to grow a pair and be a little more less influenced by others.

If only it were that simple. In most cases it's straight forward but in some cases things get intertwined and need to be cleaned up.

There is a lot less advertising going on now than there was in the past so I think we are better off than before. Do I think it could still be refined? Yes. With that said I encourage people to report these occurrences so they can be dealt with/cleaned up.



Yes, take what I said to the extreme Ryan. I didn't say they can't advertise, but when they joined as a sponsor they read the rules which stated they could only advertise in their section of the boards; and that didn't stop them from joining.
And if they want to leave because we start enforcing the rules they agreed to abide by, then that's their loss because they'll be losing a lot of business.

"Suggest one sponsor all the time"? I think you misunderstood what I said. People are going to suggest more than one sponsor. And there will be people that suggest different sponsors, so it's not going to be just one sponsor suggested all the time. However, if that does happen, then that's because the other sponsors are doing something wrong. If no one on here wants to recommend them to others, they need to step back and rethink how they are doing things (ie maybe their customer service sucks). But what we have right now is one sponsor will post up saying "I have that in stock" which then kills the thread, and none of the other sponsors want to post up after said sponsor and say that they also have it in stock.
They have a way that isn't intrusive to everyone, it's called their sponsor section of the boards. What I said was after one sponsor chimes in on a thread and says "We have that in stock", none of the others ever chime in and say "We have that in stock as well." This is what currently happens. As soon as NextMod says "I have that in stock", you don't see Garage16, or AlphaMotorSports saying "I also have that in stock". If one sponsor says "I have it in stock" the others should be saying so as well, why they don't do it is something they'll have to tell us. (READ: What I'm advocating is that if one sponsor is going to post up saying "I have that in stock" the others should too, they shouldn't shy away from it. The sponsors should all do a bit of a roll call in the thread; no talk about their prices tho, just a simple "I have that in stock", and it's up to the person asking to PM the sponsors and ask for prices. But this should only happen IF/WHEN someone asks "where can I get one".)

That's great Ryan, you aren't everyone else on here. There are a lot of people who are shy and easily pushed around, just because you're a strong-willed confident person doesn't mean everyone else is, or that they have the self-confidence to "grow a pair".

[peterm15]

I don't wanna quote the whole post but with why noob is saying about sponsors getting in saying I have it in stock to.

Most will not. Although they are competition there is corporate respect. No good company ( or one I will buy from) would say "buy from me not them"

As for pm's I would find that more annoying personally. I have been contacted by pm when I asked a install question about a product i was about to install, I already owned the product and was contacted by a sponsor for a better version.

[aris]

Let's see the thread in question you got mad cause Rick posted he has Amsoil in stock?

That thread was about where to buy Mobil 0w20 but if you read through it someone mentions Penzoil and you also mentioned mazda synthetic oil...i don't get why your so upset about Ricks post??

http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/showthread.php?39743-Mobil-1-0W20...where-can-I-get-it

[Aitch]

My take-away from this thread is two-fold, and comes from the impression that at a high level you guys are arguing for much the same thing, but getting stuck on the details about whether everything is either black or white.

1) Sponsors are not allowed to shamelessly plug their products across the board. The rules state this and in my experience, and it seems, in others, this is the majority of the daily experience. That is, it doesn't happen that much. When it does, feel free to notify mods and we will deal with it as necessary.

2) In some instances, people will be looking for a product or service, made obvious either through the original post or the ongoing content of a thread. Given that this is at least one of the purposes of that thread, it is beneficial to the members to get an answer about where they can get that product/service, either from a sponsor or a member's recommendation of a sponsor. We hope that this is done in an informative and conversational manner, rather than simply stating 'hey we have this in stock'.

Finally, I believe the sponsor rules also state tht they can't send out unsolicited PMs, and this I agree with. I think it is a bigger annoyance to have the possibility of sponsors PM'ing everyone who seems remotely interested in something they carry. Having a few posts pop up that remind people where they can get something, out of the thousands of posts we see here every day, is not the end of the world guys. And where we mods notice it, or it is brought to our attention, we will keep an eye on things and work to make things consistent. This is the suggestions forum, and the sentiments brought up are considered.

[thanu31]

I don't see a problem with sponsors occasionally mentioning a product in a thread if the question is valid to the pertaining topic or post. Even if the topic is technical and then someone asks "where can I get X product?", what is the harm of the sponsor coming in and suggesting to buy from their shop/store? It's no different than you suggesting to the member to go and buy it from a sponsor's shop or even Canadian Tire.

Now if a sponsor jumps into a topic, for example that is strictly comparing 2 products and instead of giving technical information decide to give the recommendation to buy it at their shop or that they carry this product, then that should forbidden. You are trying to make things black and white by posting the Sponsors Rules and Code of Ethics, but it's not that simple.





I just want to remind everyone that when things are strict on the board, people complain about how much of a pain in the ass the moderators are for enforcing everything. When things get a little laxed, people complain about how the rules aren't being applied to everyone all of the time. Which is it people? lol.

Things are not always easily decided as a black and white issue. If they were, there wouldn't be any question in regards to the rules, etc.

The rules and regs are to be followed but are mostly guidelines. We need to have a set of rules to start with and decide what needs to be addressed and how it needs to be addressed depending on the situation.

+ 1
I remember when there was sponsor whoring going on last year, but thats been cut down significantly
i dont see any problems as well, it is well balanced as loki stated

[Hyperion]

This
I enjoy my free club. Paying is not in my agenda.

[boyracer]

This
I enjoy my free club. Paying is not in my agenda.

+1, I fully agree.