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Thread: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Firstly there is one rule to this thread:

    No posting “I pay $XXXX in premium”, or “How much do you pay in premium?”

    For that you can post here:
    http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/sh...ad.php?t=10926

    I’ve tried to limit the FAQ to questions commonly asked on the board. If there is anything else you would like added, please let me know. Also, please feel free to point out any corrections that need to be made. This didn't take me very long to write up, so I'm sure I missed something. This is a work in progress.

    OK. Now some light reading:

    This is a publication issued by the Financial Services Commission of Ontario (FSCO). It gives very good general outline of Ontario Automobile Insurance:
    http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/in...auto-Jan07.pdf

    This is the Ontario Automobile Policy 1 (OAP1). It outlines all the statutory conditions and responsibilities of you and your insurance company:
    http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/fo...23-10-2006.pdf

    ----------------------------------------------------------


    Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    How is my premium calculated?
    FSCO’s website has an excellent tutorial on how insurance companies come up with your premium here:
    http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/in...crateguide.asp

    How can I tell who is at-fault in an accident?
    In Ontario, the Fault Determination Rules apply. You can find them here:
    http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/reg...s_900668_e.htm

    The police say that I am not at-fault but the insurance company says I am. Which is correct?
    These are two different things. For the police, they determine fault to see if you will get charged. For the insurance company, fault is determined per the Fault Determination Rules to determine if you are liable for the accident under the Insurance Act.

    What happens after I get into an accident?
    FSCO has a good publication on this process:
    http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/in...cident_ENG.pdf

    If I am found not at-fault, will my premium go up?
    No. It is illegal for the insurance company to increase your premium for not at-fault claims.

    What is no-fault insurance?
    Firstly no-fault insurance does NOT mean that no one is at-fault.
    With no-fault insurance, you always claim against your own insurance company if you are involved in an accident with another Ontario vehicle or a vehicle in a jurisdiction with a no-fault reciprocal agreement with Ontario. It is designed to eliminate much of the court costs associated with people suing insurance third party insurance companies and visa versa. In theory, this reduces the overall costs to insurance companies and keeps our premiums lower.
    Although you claim against your own insurance company, your rates will not go up if you are found to be not at-fault.

    What modifications will the insurance company allow me to do to my car?
    Appearance mods are ok. Electronics are covered up to a standard limit of $1,500 normally. Be sure to inform the insurance company of any electronics over the standard $1,500 limit so that they can insure them appropriately. Note – some insurance companies may have a different standard limit. Check with your insurance company to be sure.

    What modifications are not allowed?
    Most insurance companies have filed rules against performance and lowering modifications. For example, you fitting the vehicle with an aftermarket intake enhances the performance. The insurance company can use this information to cancel you and/or deny a claim. In general, if your car is not 15 years old or more, you can only insure your vehicle with Facility Association insurance.

    What is the Facility Association?
    (Taken from their website):
    The Facility Association is an entity established by the automobile insurance industry to ensure that automobile insurance is available to all owners and licensed drivers of motor vehicles where such owners or drivers are unable to obtain automobile insurance through the voluntary insurance market.

    Is racing at a track ok?
    No. One of the statutory conditions in the OAP1 states:

    1.4.6 You agree not to use or allow anyone to use the automobile in a race or speed test or for any illegal trade or transportation.

    If your insurance company finds out that you race the vehicle at a track or anywhere else, they will cancel your policy and/or deny claims.

    Can I let others drive my car without informing the insurance company?
    Yes. However, you must inform the insurance company of all people in your household who hold valid driver's licences.
    Also, as the owner, it is up to you to ensure that the vehicle is driven by someone trustworthy. Any claims would count against the owner's policy.

    What happens if I hit an animal (i.e. moose, deer, etc.)?
    There are two scenarios to consider. If the animal was in motion and ran into you or you ran into it, then this is a Comprehensive claim. You are not at-fault, but must pay your Comprehensive deductible.
    If you hit a stationary animal (i.e., roadkill), then this could be considered a Collision claim. You would likely be deemed at-fault as if you hit a stationary object on the road.

    Will my premium drop when I turn 25?
    In general, your rate will go down with respect to your age with most insurance companies. So if all other factors remain the same, your premium will go down. However, some things like general rate increases or getting a speeding conviction can offset your savings.

    How does an at-fault accident affect my premium?
    (copied from FSCO's website)
    In many cases, if you have your first at-fault accident after six or more years of claims-free and conviction-free driving, your premium may not change or may increase by a relatively small amount. Some insurance companies offer endorsements to drivers that will allow them to maintain their driving record or premium after a first at-fault accident. Most companies will change your driving record to reflect the accident and increase your premium by a small amount. You will need to regain your six years of accident-free driving before you return to lower premiums. If this is your second at-fault accident in the last six years, you can expect your premiums to increase quite significantly.
    If you have any convictions or cancellations of a policy, in addition to an at-fault accident, or are an inexperienced driver with an at-fault accident, you may be considered to be a high-risk driver and be placed with an insurer that specializes in these types of risks.

    What is "Full Coverage"?
    There's no such thing. No Ontario Automobile Insurance policy comes without exceptions.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    CORRESPONDING THREAD: MODIFICATIONS AND YOUR INSURANCE
    http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/sh...ad.php?t=23202
    Last edited by Skarbro; 07-17-2008 at 09:47 AM.
    2006 Mazda 3 Sport GT●Black Mica●Manual●Sunroof


  2. #2
    Sr Member 3GFX's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Thank you. Stickied.
    - - - - - - | NOW | 08' VW Jetta 2.0T | - - - - - - - | BEFORE | 04' Mazda 3 GT/GFX | - - - - - -

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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Nice contribution Ken.. Good info.
    Damn you photobucket.....

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    Member doughboyr6's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    good job.

    -----------------
    THEN 2005 Mazda3 GT/GFX - 5MT - Stubby - Work XD-9 - Sumitomo HTR Z III - Rays Lug Nuts - Eibach Prokit - TWM STS - RX8 Knob - Leather Shift Boot - Borla Cat Back - 35% Tints - Progress Rear Sway - Philips D2S 4300K - Vibrant Strut Bar - BuddyClub Condenser - SPC Camber Kit - Fujita F5 CAI - StreetUnit Motor Mount - Mazdaspeed Clutch - Rotora Slotted Rotors - Hawk HPS - Indy Fog Mod - Koni Yellow - PSI Tuned - Straight Pipe
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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Thanks. I'll keep an eye out for more common insurance questions on the board and add them to the list.

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    Sr Member Gizzmo_jr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    What about a FAQ part? Like "If I hit an animal" question. I've been through it and its really quite simple. It's deemed no fault and covered under collision comprehensive. No rate increase cause of no fault. It's better to hit the animal, then to avoid and hit something else which is now an at fault accident and not covered.
    Diesel tractor...

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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by Gizzmo_jr View Post
    What about a FAQ part? Like "If I hit an animal" question. I've been through it and its really quite simple. It's deemed no fault and covered under collision comprehensive. No rate increase cause of no fault. It's better to hit the animal, then to avoid and hit something else which is now an at fault accident and not covered.
    Added!

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    Sr Member Soyabean's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    speaking of this animal hitting thing. I have a question.

    If i do hit one (knock on wood i hope i dont), do i stay at the scene and call the police? or should i keep driving and call the insurance company later on during the day? Like wouldn't the insurance company need to have someone check it out to see if your car was actually damaged because you hit an animal?

    And im sure this is different from hitting a racoon which can cause minor bumper damage and hitting a deer which can cause some pretty severe damage to the front.

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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by Soyabean View Post
    And im sure this is different from hitting a racoon which can cause minor bumper damage and hitting a deer which can cause some pretty severe damage to the front.
    Funny you should say that.

    A client of mine that picked up last year, recently hit a racoon, spun, ditch, roll... = write off.

    Yes... a racoon.

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    Newbie jstro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Hey, useful information - always wondered about a lot of this stuff.

    Thank you, sir.
    Don't hassel the Hoff

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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by Soyabean View Post
    speaking of this animal hitting thing. I have a question.

    If i do hit one (knock on wood i hope i dont), do i stay at the scene and call the police? or should i keep driving and call the insurance company later on during the day? Like wouldn't the insurance company need to have someone check it out to see if your car was actually damaged because you hit an animal?

    And im sure this is different from hitting a racoon which can cause minor bumper damage and hitting a deer which can cause some pretty severe damage to the front.
    It's always wise to take pictures. These days most everyone has a camera-phone. A raccoon is the same as a moose liability-wise. It's not your fault if he runs out of nowhere in front of your car. But you will still need to pay the collision deductible.

    I've had arguments with some claims adjusters on this issue. Many of them charge this situation as at-fault. Fight this until you turn blue. It's a common mistake in the industry.

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    Member doughboyr6's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    my understanding is that if it is an animal that runs out in front of the car and alive before the impact, it would be paid under comprehensive not collision and your deductible applies. But if it was already dead on the road and you hit/run over it and causes damage, then it's paid under collision and its respective deductible applies.

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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by doughboyr6 View Post
    my understanding is that if it is an animal that runs out in front of the car and alive before the impact, it would be paid under comprehensive not collision and your deductible applies. But if it was already dead on the road and you hit/run over it and causes damage, then it's paid under collision and its respective deductible applies.
    I think that it's treated 2 different ways depending on if you hit the animal head-on or not. But you are right in that in many cases it is handled as a Comprehensive claim. I'll update the FAQ...

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    Sr Member SilentJay's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    How about the length of time an at-fault accident stays a factor in premium determination? I've read 6 or 7 years through various sources.



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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by SilentJay View Post
    How about the length of time an at-fault accident stays a factor in premium determination? I've read 6 or 7 years through various sources.
    Added!

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    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Here's a link to a Q&A in today's Toronto Star on insurance, mods, and racetracks. It hits the nail right on the head:

    http://www.wheels.ca/article/213810

    Mods for racetrack threaten insurance

    Only resort is Facility Association when most insurers will not cover highly modified vehicles

    Eric Lai
    Toronto Star
    Mar 22, 2008

    Q: How do insurance companies handle people who run their cars on the race track?
    I'd previously asked about modifying my suspension but was warned they would drop my coverage even for that. I've had no tickets or accidents.
    What implications would there be if they found out that I track the car three to eight times during the summer season?
    Everyone agrees that racing should be on the track rather than the streets, but there seems to be little information out there for people who want to enjoy this hobby safely and legally.
    A: James Geuzebroek, media relations manager with the Insurance Bureau of Canada, advises that most underwriters in the regular market will not insure vehicles with major modifications – especially those designed to improve track performance.
    Your existing automobile insurance policy also will not provide coverage while the vehicle is being used on the track.
    Coverage can be obtained for regular, on-road use of modified or track-driven vehicles through the Facility Association, states Geuzebroek.
    Eric Lai adds:
    To guard against liability, insurers seem to presume that all vehicles modified for extreme-performance driving will be used for such – be it on-track or by endangering everyone on public roadways – rather than being just for show. As such, these autos are placed in the high-risk category and owners must seek insurance through the Facility Association, which is known as the insurer of last resort for convicted drunk drivers and others that regular underwriters do not wish to represent.
    Owners of unmodified vehicles may also find themselves in the same dilemma if a driver on their policy is convicted of dangerous/impaired driving or a so-called "street racing" offence, or has multiple at-fault collisions currently on record.

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    Newbie TheLouch's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    A rather heavy read, but the OAP publication does address a number of 'grey' areas, such as allowing others to use your vehicle:

    Section 3 - Liability Coverage
    3.2 Who is Covered

    You are covered when you, or anyone else in possession of a described automobile with your consent, uses or operates it. We will consider these other people insured persons.
    So it seems that as long as you consent to another person using your vehicle, they and the vehicle are still covered under your policy. But that begs the question - what is the point of adding a secondary or "occasional" driver to your policy?

    This is especially odd in circumstances where children use their parent's vehicles. I've always been under the impression that in order for a child to legally drive their parent's vehicle, they must be a named driver under the parent's insurance policy. Where as Para 3.2 suggests that all a child needs to do in order to be fully covered by the policy is have their parent's consent.

    Does anyone have any insight into this?

    Also the link to the above could use an update - new version as of 1 Jan 2007:
    http://www.fsco.gov.on.ca/english/fo...23-10-2006.pdf
    ...same document on ontarioinsurance.com:
    http://ontarioinsurance.com/english/...23-10-2006.pdf

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    Sr Member Wild Weasel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Your insurance company must be aware of any licensed drivers living in your household. That's where things like secondary or occasional drivers come into play.

    If you don't live with your parents, then you don't need to be listed on their policy. If you DO live with your parents though, and aren't listed, and need to make a claim, then they would be in violation of the policy for not having told the company about you, and the claim could be denied.

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    Newbie TheLouch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    That makes no sense what so ever ... So let me get this straight - those who live in the same household have to pay an extra $100-150 a month premium to be listed as a second driver, where as those who live on their own are able to receive the exact same coverage benefits without paying a dime?

  20. #20
    Sr Member Skarbro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLouch View Post
    That makes no sense what so ever ... So let me get this straight - those who live in the same household have to pay an extra $100-150 a month premium to be listed as a second driver, where as those who live on their own are able to receive the exact same coverage benefits without paying a dime?
    Occasional drivers have to pay extra? I can only speak from experience on this, but I know of a few insurance companies that do not charge extra for listed occasional drivers. The vehicle premium is normally tied to the driving record of the principle driver without any surcharges for occasional drivers.

    EDIT: I guess they do charge a little extra:

    Consider gaining experience as a named occasional driver under the insurance policy of a parent or guardian, rather than as a principal driver of your own vehicle. Premiums for young, occasional drivers are much lower than premiums for young, principal drivers.
    I suppose it has to do with the predictabilty of the exposure. In general, they do not expect you to lend your car out to someone that has no experience like a new occasional driver in your household.

    BTW, thanks. I've updated the OAP1 link.
    Last edited by Skarbro; 07-17-2008 at 09:54 AM.

  21. #21
    Sr Member Wild Weasel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLouch View Post
    That makes no sense what so ever ... So let me get this straight - those who live in the same household have to pay an extra $100-150 a month premium to be listed as a second driver, where as those who live on their own are able to receive the exact same coverage benefits without paying a dime?
    That's correct. As Skarbro said, it's expected that people living with you will have regular access to your car, therefore the risk has to be considered when writing the premium.

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    Newbie TheLouch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Quote Originally Posted by Skarbro View Post
    I guess they do charge a little extra

    I suppose it has to do with the predictabilty of the exposure. In general, they do not expect you to lend your car out to someone that has no experience like a new occasional driver in your household.
    Actually it's hardly a "little extra" - when I was first starting out driving I was listed as an occasional driver on my dad's insurance, and I was paying $150 a month - 30 bucks more than what he was paying as the primary driver ... and that was 10 years ago, so I can only imagine how much that'd cost now days.

    What I find really odd however, is that I could've moved out across the street, used those $150/mth on rent instead, still used my dad's car as much as I would've living at home, and would've been completely legal to drive without paying as much as a cent for insurance? See, that is what I find really strange.

  23. #23
    Sr Member Wild Weasel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    That's correct. BUT, you would not have been building our own insurance history so when it came time for you to get your own car, you would have ended up paying much more.

    Basically, if you're driving the car, you need to pay insurance. People aren't expected to lend their cars out regularly to people not living with them. It's a big risk to the insured because if they lend it out and something happens, it's their premiums that are going to go up. This expected minimal lending is already priced into every policy.

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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Does "2Way insurance" cover shot tranny ? or stuff like this ... ?
    Is there a good insurance that you can buy and will cover stuff like this ?

  25. #25
    Sr Member Wild Weasel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ontario Auto Insurance FAQ

    Are you thinking about an extended warranty? Insurance doesn't cover break-downs. It only covers damage caused by mishaps. If you drive over a raised manhole cover that rips through your tranny (assuming you're not lowered) then insurance should cover it. If the tranny just breaks on it's own, then they wouldn't.

    What's this "2way" think you're referring to?

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