Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Yeah and it's killing me not to patch up the rust spots. But pending final word from Mazda Canada on my case, I don't want to hide the evidence if I want to show it to the District Service Manager and Regional Mazda rep. You can't imagine how frustrating it is to drive around a car I baby so much looking like that.... Well, at least it is serving as a banner for my car's crappy paint job and Mazda's sub-standard treatment in that regard.
Sept 24/08 - Traded in 2004 Mazda3 Sport GT auto (Winning Blue) for 2009 Honda Fit Sport auto (Orange Revolution) due to paint/rust issue and sub-par dealership experience
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
I also have the rust problem. Its on the back wheel wells. Its 2004 with 109k. Passed the warranty.. If there is anyway to help put pressure on mazda to have this as a recall issue id love to help
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
I'll keep everyone updated on how my case proceeds. Both myself and "txyu" are exactly in the same boat with 2004 models and having to deal with the same dealership here in Sudbury. If it comes to the point that our Service Manager tells us "no help from Mazda", we'll get in to see the District Service Manager and/or the Regional Mazda Rep.
Main thing is for everyone out there dealing with this same issue, COMPLAIN TO YOUR DEALERSHIP! Nothing will ever get done if Mazda believes that it's just a handful of irrate customers. If enough complaints come in, then they'll be forced to act. It's a seriously frustrating and long process, but don't give up and keep us all posted here....
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Note, just got a reply to a similar post I have on the Mazda3 forum. People there are also getting pretty eager to launch a group effort in addressing this issue with Mazda Canada. If anyone here has legal expertise in such matters, I'd be very interested in hearing from you!
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
as far as perforation is concerned - if my car was rusting like that i would have stuck a screwdriver thru the rust before warranty expired and told dealer 'look - its perforated!'
as far as the rust in the doorjambs is concerned - that's from stone chips that were not touched up...sorry if someone else mentioned this - should cover that with 3M urethane film
bj21
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Well first of all, my 5 year corrosion warranty is not up. I have 1 year left to go on that. Also, before my 3 year warranty was up I did bring the car into my dealership and mentioned the rusting so it wasn't an oversight on my part in not addressing this issue when it began.
As for the stone chips and other rusted areas, I HAVE been sanding away the rust and touching up with paint. Also, all the rust in the door jams have associated blisters. Many blisters on my car do not have any type of impact point so are clearly not due to rock chips. I think you're missing the point. On a car that is well maintained, inside and out, and is barely 4 years old, the paint should not be that fragile. I've done everything I can as an owner and yet my car still looks like you see in my posted pictures! There is no way anybody can tell me that I should accept any responsibility for the way the car looks. These first generation Mazda3s obviously have a serious paint defect, plain and simple.
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-26-2008 at 01:14 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
From what I see from the photos you posted, it is clearly a corrosion of the body sheet metal underneath the paint which has caused the bubbling and blistering.Note; THIS IS MOST DEFINITELY COVERED UNDER WARRANTY ACCORDING TO MAZDA'S WARRANTY STATEMENT, which is plainly stated on the Mazda.ca site for all Mazda vehicles.
If you haven't already I would suggest you send those photos to Mazda Canada ASAP, along with a nice note mentioning it has been looked at by Sudbury Mazda and disregarded, whereas it is clear to other body experts that it is 'body panel corrosion'.The clear fact that there are no chips or scratches where most of the bubbling and blistering is occuring is a clear indication and early signs of perforation.
Keep a firm head and Keep us posted!
I'm going to take a good look at my car now
_3
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Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
THANK YOU!!!! That's what I'm trying to get people to understand. I don't drive down dirt roads, I don't tailgate, and I have babied this car from the get go. Nothing anyone could have done from an ownership perspective would have prevented this! It's the paint, not the paint maintenance that's the issue.
I'll look over the wording of the warranty more closely. All comes down to semantics....some people (ok, most in the industry) consider perforation = holes, others consider perforation = blistering too since it is clearly an issue with the paint no longer adhering to the metal frame, for whatever reason....
Oh, I'm in this for the long haul, believe me! I edited my pictures today and really zeroed in on the blistering. Some do show minute hole at the top, perhaps attributable to stone chips. Others show no signs of chipping at all. Glad I spent the time taking those shots with a digital then editing them to clearly show the extent of the damage. To all others in a similar situation, do the same! You need clear visual proof before you do anything to your cars...
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Oh, FYI, the more I look at my car the more blistering I find. The two large ones on the front quarter panel by my driver door I only found yesterday. So, if you do look at your car closely (and it does take some patience to find these...look at it from the sides), be prepared! Heart breaking really...
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Ok, just looked over the warranty manual and found this information:
"Perforation: Covers perforated panels (rust through) due to defects in material or workmanship under normal use."
On page 20 under the section "ANTI-PERFORATION LIMITED WARRANTY":
"Mazda warrants that the body sheet metal panels of your new Mazda Vehicle are free
from defects in material or workmanship which result in perforation (a hole through the
body panel) due to corrosion, subject to the following terms and conditions. Corrosion
other than perforation (a hole through the body panel), due to defects in material or workmanship, is covered under the New Vehicle Limited Warranty."
They add the "rust through" and "hole through the body panel" to cover their butts obviously. Do you know how long a hole would take to develop? Clearly they expected that little addition in wording to cover any corrosion claims that would fall within the 5 year period. Personally I think that it's very misleading but, to be fair, it is common practice in the auto industry.
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-26-2008 at 01:15 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Read the warranty info on the Mazda site.It states exactly this; "body sheet metal perforation for 5 years and unlimited mileage." ...(no mention of holes!)
In the 'what's not covered' section its stated exactly as; "Surface corrosion on any part OTHER THAN the body sheet metal panels forming the exterior appearance of the vehicle"
Basically to me these statements are saying that corrosion on exterior panels is covered, rust thru does not mean holes, it also covers rust forming on the sheet metal underneath and perforating itself out 'breaking thru' the paint which is the bubbling and the blistering and exactly what you are experiencing on your vehicle, unfortunitely.
Anyways, I just went over my 05' with a flashlight and a magnifying glass and checked all the areas you covered in your photos and I'm happy to say, to my relief mind you, I found no sign of rust or corrosion or perforation or whatever the manufacturers want to call it......lucky me I guess.
Other than the year, colour difference and the fact I had mine sprayed on day one, there is no difference between the way our two vehicles have been maintained, so it only goes to reason its a manufacturers defect.Atleast you would think it would be that clear-cut!
_3
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Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Well, the warranty booklet we all got with our vehicles states the proper procedure to follow to get warranty issues resolved. First is to take the booklet in to the dealership and deal with the local Service Manager. Therefore, the wording in the booklet is going to be taken as the final word on this, from my perspective anyways.
What did you have your car sprayed with? I'm going to have to really do my research on my next vehicle purchase. Mind you, I really did think I was covering all the bases with my Mazda3, doing all I could to maintain the car's exterior. Obviously that didn't work out for me.
Just wondering what other products are out there that can help to avoid any corrosion issues? Apparently the new painting process, brought about by environmental regulations, is widespread in the industry so I worry that my next car will also have fragile paint. Well, Nissan DID come out with a self-healing type of paint so that gives me a bit of hope. Needless to say, whatever car manufacturer/dealership has to deal with me on my next purchase is going to have to put up with a fair measure of paranoia from me....
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Well take the book in but try educating them on what exactly perforation is! Perforation can mean rust thru the paint from underneath,(corrosion of the sheet metal), not necessarily a complete hole thru the body panel."The bubbling is the key".The one pic you showed on one of your door panels which looked like a pimple was a perfect example of the sheet metal corroding underneath the paint and peaking thru the paint, (where you thought it looked like a chip, it was the rust actually breaking thru).
I used Krown from day one, drove straight to Krown from the dealer! Asked the guy to soak it good, had that shit running out of the seams for months....happens every year!!
The guy down here which I use seemed to know his stuff because he took his time spraying certain areas miticulously, one being the rear quarter panels and seams.....and it seems to work quite well as the last time I inspected my vehicle, (when it was on a hoist), I found not a spec of rust anywhere on the vehicle underpinnings or anywhere else.
I haven't heard of Nissan's healing paint, I'm curious now!!, but the problem seems to be widespread, even on other forums; Jaguer, BMW etc; etc; are all suffering the same problems! So its not just Mazda specific.
Vw, Audi seem to have it down pat and give a ten year warranty to back it up but then with those two you have to worry about electrical problems...goe figure
Good luck on your visit to the dealer! (and don't go alone)
_3
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Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
As for not going alone to the dealership, well if I could locate a couple of burly men I would happily bring them along (just kidding!) I'm hoping that Tim (txyu), who also deals with Mid City Mazda in Sudbury, can come along with me. Both of us complaining of the same issue will add more weight to our individual concerns. Also, I'm working on getting proof (pictures, copy of corrosion repair invoice) from two other Mazda3 owners to bring with me on my next visit to the dealership. The Service Manager asked Tim for proof that owners were getting the repairs done under the 5 year warranty, so I'll be happy to comply with his request...
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-26-2008 at 01:15 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
The problem lies in that no oil spraying or anything you do is going to help if the sheet metal panels were/are defective! and that is what I believe is the problem! The metal seems to be rusting under the paint and primer and possibly not from the other side of the sheet metal or inner panel.....Bad paint? I doubt it, bad primer?, maybe, Bad sheet metal? most likely...Its pretty common for Japanese metal to be inferior (Its actually from China I believe)....Its definitley a manufacturers defect is the point!
I suggest you take atleast one Big Burly guy with you just for insurance...he might just tip the scale for you
_3
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Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Hmm....so if it's an issue not with the painting process but with the sheet metal, I'd deduce that nothing will help and that will recur over and over! So if I get the areas (i.e. most of the car) sandblasted and professionally refinished, it will just rust again? If that's the case, I'm not really sure how to proceed. Is there anything that can be done to treat the sheet metal, before refinishing, to ensure that it doesn't rust again?
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-16-2008 at 03:23 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
that rust is evil. i'd have to agree with Flagrum, too; "rust-through" could mean rusting through the paint, which plainly is what seems to be happening. definitely keep pushing mazda to have it looked after. i'm going to be checking my car with a fine-toothed comb after my next wash.
don't get your hopes up with the self-healing paint though; it's clearcoat only (for the moment). it won't heal through stone chips or major scratches, and it takes a while to heal (up to a week).
There is a theory which states that a billion monkeys pounding on a billion keyboards will eventually produce the works of Shakespeare.
Thanks to the Internet, we now know this theory is wrong.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Well, you and I can agree about what classifies as perforation but the key point is getting Mazda Canada on board. They are adamant that perforation = holes only. That's what really got me moving on this. I thought that what I had on my car was "only" surface corrosion until my sister's friend (who works at a luxury dealership) looked at my car and said "um, you have blistering all over the sides". Could have knocked me over with a feather! I visited my dealership the very next day.
Now, after spending 4 hours cleaning the car and inspecting every single inch of the paint, the blistering is actually considerably worse than what first got me riled up! Aside from the doors, it's also on the bottom part of the car (you know, when you open the door...the bottom part) at all 4 doors and now I've discovered it on the front quarter panel on the driver side. The pictures actually really helped me to see the blistering/bubbling fully. I have several shots without ANY type of impact point so the dealership's argument that all the damage is due to rock chips is firmly refutted....
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-16-2008 at 03:24 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
i am no expert but i know that perforated = hole
per·fo·rate Audio Help /v. ˈpɜrfəˌreɪt; adj. ˈpɜrfərɪt, -fəˌreɪt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[v. pur-fuh-reyt; adj. pur-fer-it, -fuh-reyt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation verb, -rat·ed, -rat·ing, adjective
–verb (used with object) 1. to make a hole or holes through by boring, punching, piercing, or the like.
2. to pierce through or to the interior of; penetrate.
–verb (used without object) 3. to make a way through or into something; penetrate.
–adjective 4. perforated.
that being said i am very surprised that Mazda is blowing you off on this especially if you have been getting the car rustproofed annually at Krown - that is crazy
this is a fight that you should win - and i would seriously consider the screwdriver
when (an if) you do get this painted - i would get rid of the car right away because no matter what they do - this rust is coming back
bj
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Well that was my issue too! Perforation, as I understand it and as it is clearly worded in our warranty manuals, is a hole. HOWEVER, whatever the heck is going on with my car rusting and blistering all over is obviously due to some underlying issue with the body sheet metal. That said, Mazda Canada should take responsibility for this manufacturing defect and compensate me for the repair. Also, I'm keenly aware that the $2000 this is going to cost to fix won't equal a permanent end to rust! If it is an issue with the metal, I'm not sure what the body repair shop can do to rectify that before refininishing.
Last edited by ZoomZoom Girl; 06-16-2008 at 03:25 PM.
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
If you want to view all my pictures on my car corrosion issue, see them here:
http://s8.photobucket.com/albums/a38...Mazda3%20rust/
Password: ZoomZoom
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
if you were to get this fixed on Mazda's tab - there is no way that i would wait out those last 2 years....that rust will come back quickly...paint it and sell it/trade-in
what are they putting on the roads up there in Sudbury??
bj
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Definition no#2 says it clearly...rust perforating the paint surface is exactly what is happening.Originally Posted by bj21
I would suggest strongly against using a screwdriver or any means to try to make it worse! (That can just end up being used against her).
ZoomZoom, How much time do you have till the 5 years is up?
_3
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Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
That's something to consider. Do I just patch the rust myself and wait it out until I'm ready to sell, or do I get it done now? Hey, if I wait maybe there WILL be holes by then! Oh but of course my 5 year perforation warranty will be up....just can't win.
Have you ever been to Sudbury? Our roads leave alot to be desired...
Re: Major paint repair on 2004 model
Ha, ha...I'm determined but not NUTS. No need to worry about my going crazy with the screwdriver. I took ownership of my car June 30/2004 so the 5 years will be up June 30 of next year.
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