SPEEDING TICKET

[05Mazda3GT]

Hey guys, I need your help with a few things. Today I recieved a speeding ticket for going 15km/h over. :bang I don't loose any dermit points and only pay a small fine. I got my first speeding ticket back in september for going 10km/h over, and also didn't get any dermit points.

My insurance did not increase after the first ticket, but now I am concerned. Even though I still don't have any dermit points, do you think my insurance will increase now? Or does it depend on my insurance company? Also, after three years when both tickets are off my record, will my insurance decrease if it increases this time?

Btw i'm an 18 male which probably doesnt help the fact, lol.
Please get back to me on this one ASAP.

Thanks,

Andrew

[Burner]

Has your insurance renewed since your last ticket? If so they may not have pulled your record, or the ticket hadn't been processed at the time they did pull your record for renewal. Tickets are usually surcharged at 5% per minor conviction. So I'd expect at least a 10% increase when you renew.

[htc***]

Hey guys, I need your help with a few things. Today I recieved a speeding ticket for going 15km/h over. :bang I don't loose any dermit points and only pay a small fine. I got my first speeding ticket back in september for going 10km/h over, and also didn't get any dermit points.

My insurance did not increase after the first ticket, but now I am concerned. Even though I still don't have any dermit points, do you think my insurance will increase now? Or does it depend on my insurance company? Also, after three years when both tickets are off my record, will my insurance decrease if it increases this time?

Btw i'm an 18 male which probably doesnt help the fact, lol.
Please get back to me on this one ASAP.

Thanks,

Andrew

You can delay the fine and your driving record which you tick the option 3 (not guilty) and go to the court. You won't receive the court's date from between 3 to 1 year sometime 2. When you renew your insurance, they only see you have 1 speeding then they won't hike your premium. I think they keep speeding up to 3 years in driving record. you only paid 2 speeding ticket for second renew, the 3rd renew, you only have 1 because the first speeding in September will drop it off from your record.

[05Mazda3GT]

Burner: I havent renewed my insurance since before my first ticket, I actually think I renew it soon.

htc***: I can't tick option 3 (not guilty) and fight it because I was actually doing 35km/h over. I just got lucky that he gave me a break :)

[Burner]

You can still fight it. Sometimes they lower the fine because they don't want to go to court. If he really wanted to give you a break he could have just given you a warning.

[05Mazda3GT]

Ok, now my question is: If i dont fight it, and just let it be. After 3 years when both tickets are gone (assuming I don't get any more), will my insurance drop back down?

[htc***]

Burner: I havent renewed my insurance since before my first ticket, I actually think I renew it soon.

htc***: I can't tick option 3 (not guilty) and fight it because I was actually doing 35km/h over. I just got lucky that he gave me a break :)

Does he put any note or record on his book??? if he did then at the court you can ask the judge or prosecute to reduce you fine. If he did not then by that time he might forgot what he'd done. Remember to ask for the proof when you tick option 3. This is a situation you have delay the 2nd ticket get in to your driving record for your insurance which they only see 1 when you renew it. If he did not show up at the court's date then you're free to go.

[Krazy]

One thing... the 3 years for ur ticket to clear... starts the day you pay the fine. (a little fyi)

Also... insurance looks at your number of tickets issued. NOT the point deduction from those tickets.... they got nothing to do with insurance.

When they pull ur record from like police reports... they will see those 2 tickets regardless of demerit points and you will be stuck with higher rate.

You are only 18. Pay it off early and hope for a decrease when you hit 21.

[sp3GT]

I think you should fight it, demerit points having nothing to do with insurance. Once you pay it, it's a conviction and insurance will see it. Depending on the insurance company you're with they might or might not increase your rate.

[loganm3]

If you got the ticket in Toronto I know how you can get out of it (66% chance by my results)....it is time intensive though! Worst case scenerio is you end up having to plead guilty and pay $20 in court costs....but it also delays the ticket by about a year so it's worth it.

Here's how I did it:

I ticked option 3 on the ticket, had to go request a court date in person. I waited about 6 months and they sent me a court date in the mail (ticket in October, courtdate in July) this is a pretty average timeline for Toronto. When you get the letter informing you of your court date wait about 3 weeks to a month to go to the courthouse and request "discolsure" (this is the evidence they have against you, basically the cop's notes and it's free to get). Toronto is so backlogged majority of the time they take months to get you your discolsure. I requested mine in mid May and they called me in August to pick it up!

Here's the tricky part....court time! It depends on your prosacutor, but I asked mine if I could get another date (adjurnment) as I had not recieved my disclosure. Prosacutor said "ok". I get called up infront of the judge, proscutor says "request for dismissal as disclosure has not been given" and bam, ticket is tossed.

This has worked for me and a friend. One friend had his court date adjurned to another date, so he was dead in the water. He had a simular story to you, 20km over but cop gave him a 10km ticket. 2nd court date he asked to plead guilty to the ticket, his $50 fine was reduced to $20....tack on the $20 in court costs he saved himself $10 and he ate up a year and a half of time.

Make sure you keep all paper work, especially your request for discolsure.

[05Mazda3GT]

Thanks a lot, that really helps. I guess i'll be pleading not guilty haha.

[Krazy]

The plan seems good except... keep in mind the date of the ticket starts when you pay it. So for the ticket to get dropped from ur record (for insurance) it will be 6 months + 3 years. (Not sure what happens when the ticket gets "tossed"

Good luck with the fight

[ST3ALTH]

heres a tip for next time.............








DO THE SPEED LIMIT! lol.

[Kaiserhead]

Fight every ticket!!! I hired Pointts the first time and did what they did on my own every time after that. So far, no convictions. You can't beat them on evidence, but you can beat them on procedure.

[ST3ALTH]

Fight every ticket!!! I hired Pointts the first time and did what they did on my own every time after that. So far, no convictions. You can't beat them on evidence, but you can beat them on procedure.

Thats just ridiculous! how about you own up to speeding and pay the $50 speeding ticket. If you have a legitimate reason to fight it then go ahead but if you know you were speeding and you got caught then just pay the ticket and be done with it.

[MAZDA Kitten]

Burner: I havent renewed my insurance since before my first ticket, I actually think I renew it soon.

htc***: I can't tick option 3 (not guilty) and fight it because I was actually doing 35km/h over. I just got lucky that he gave me a break :)

Wont that be hard to fight? He already lowered it... it will say "R" on the ticket somewhere indicating that it has been 'reduced'

[Scottobot]

Personally from an ethical perspective I think you should just count your lucky stars the cop was kind enough to give you a break and don't add unnecessarily to the overburdened legal system with a case that you know you're guilty on for selfish reasons. Take your lumps, pay the ticket (and whatever insurance consequences) and slow down.

If I were a cop and someone fought a ticket I already gave them a break on I'd be pissed, and would probably be less forgiving to future speeders.

[05Mazda3GT]

Thats what i'm thinking, maybe its best to just pay it and get it over with.

Guess I have to start driving like an old man now :complain

[m_bisson]

wtf? where do you guys live that you get speeding tickets for going 10 over? We, including the police, routinely go 20 over and never get ticketed. (school zones excepted)

[Scottobot]

Thats what i'm thinking, maybe its best to just pay it and get it over with.

Guess I have to start driving like an old man now :complain

I am an old man. It's not so bad. :)
Just use cruise control. I drive a Speed3 and set the cruise for 10 over (or a little higher depending on traffic). If I didn't use cruise control I'm sure I'd get into lots of trouble.

[htc***]

Wont that be hard to fight? He already lowered it... it will say "R" on the ticket somewhere indicating that it has been 'reduced'

The judge will ask the officer the reason why does he reduce the speeding and explain??? If he can not explain it then the judge might say "the case is not clear to him and you're free to go"



If you got the ticket in Toronto I know how you can get out of it (66% chance by my results)....it is time intensive though! Worst case scenerio is you end up having to plead guilty and pay $20 in court costs....but it also delays the ticket by about a year so it's worth it.

Here's how I did it:

I ticked option 3 on the ticket, had to go request a court date in person. I waited about 6 months and they sent me a court date in the mail (ticket in October, courtdate in July) this is a pretty average timeline for Toronto. When you get the letter informing you of your court date wait about 3 weeks to a month to go to the courthouse and request "discolsure" (this is the evidence they have against you, basically the cop's notes and it's free to get). Toronto is so backlogged majority of the time they take months to get you your discolsure. I requested mine in mid May and they called me in August to pick it up!

Here's the tricky part....court time! It depends on your prosacutor, but I asked mine if I could get another date (adjurnment) as I had not recieved my disclosure. Prosacutor said "ok". I get called up infront of the judge, proscutor says "request for dismissal as disclosure has not been given" and bam, ticket is tossed.

This has worked for me and a friend. One friend had his court date adjurned to another date, so he was dead in the water. He had a simular story to you, 20km over but cop gave him a 10km ticket. 2nd court date he asked to plead guilty to the ticket, his $50 fine was reduced to $20....tack on the $20 in court costs he saved himself $10 and he ate up a year and a half of time.

Make sure you keep all paper work, especially your request for discolsure.

+1. If he's not show up for the court's date then you're free to go.

[loganm3]

Wont that be hard to fight? He already lowered it... it will say "R" on the ticket somewhere indicating that it has been 'reduced'

The "R" will be found in the cop's notes, not on the ticket.

The last thing the prosacutor want is you to actually go to trial. They will ask you many times if you want to plead guilty, and that plead is to the fine on the ticket. NEVER go to trial unless you have bulletproof evidence (like your identity was stolen).

[Burner]

The "R" will be found in the cop's notes, not on the ticket.

The last thing the prosacutor want is you to actually go to trial. They will ask you many times if you want to plead guilty, and that plead is to the fine on the ticket. NEVER go to trial unless you have bulletproof evidence (like your identity was stolen).

They're supposed to put the "R" right beside the speed on the ticket.

[taz4432]

Personally from an ethical perspective I think you should just count your lucky stars the cop was kind enough to give you a break and don't add unnecessarily to the overburdened legal system with a case that you know you're guilty on for selfish reasons. Take your lumps, pay the ticket (and whatever insurance consequences) and slow down.

If I were a cop and someone fought a ticket I already gave them a break on I'd be pissed, and would probably be less forgiving to future speeders.


Give the kid a break, he got a ticket and guilty or not he's allowed to fight it. Until the policing and the legal system in this city is run perfectly you shouldn't be calling him selfish for doing what 99% of drivers would do. With the ticket quotas in place I call in to question every single ticket given. I.e. if the policing system is unethical, why should we, the drivers, be called unethical for fighting these tickets? Furthermore, your statement makes you a bit of a hypocrite because further down you mention that you often/always speed (10 over or more if traffic permits) - if you're preaching that he should just pay the ticket based on 'ethical grounds' I would say that you shouldn't be speeding for much the same reason. If you can't/don't practice what you preach - don't preach.

Also, do you know how much the cops get paid to go to court? They freaking love it. They get paid a minimum 4 hours even if it takes 10 minutes not to mention the ridiculous overtime. The Star has had some good articles on the subject over the past few months (I found the article but it's only an abstract and you need to pay to see it in its entirety).

Now, I don't agree with excessive speeding - personally, I never normally go even/more than 10 over on any roads other than highways and rural back/country roads (unless the FLOW - not one or two cars - is doing it) - but 15 over is not *that* much given that the standard is generally 10, especially if that 15 is not reduced. The difference between 10 and 15 can be as little as a slight downhill or a blip on the throttle - you're an older gentleman driving a Speed3 so I should hope that you would understand better than most the ease with which 10 can turn into 15 and thus turn into a ticket. That doesn't make it right - part of driving is being aware of not only your surroundings but also yourself - but a driver going 15km/h over who's entirely aware of his surroundings is (far) less dangerous than the one going 10km/h over but spending 90% of his time with his eyes on the speedo.
As you mentioned, cruise control helps but personally I will never, ever use cruise control; to me it's just not driving. Plus, unless you're out on the roads at 4am using cruise control in the city/GTA/etc. is just not realistic, even on the main streets.

Lastly, it's not paying for the tickets that's the problem, it's the ridiculous insurance costs. I myself used to be a 'speed demon' and all it took was a ticket or two and now I'm the opposite. If it were a matter of just paying the ticket I don't think most people would ever bother going to court unless they had points at risk but with the cost of insurance so ridiculously high, why give them another reason to gouge you?



Edit: Before you say that I only stopped speeding because of the money - to an extent yes, but I was young and at least somewhat stupid before and I think it takes most people their first ticket for speeding to bring it down to that '10 over limit'. Now that I'm a little older (and a little poorer, hah) I see things a little clearer. That being said, when I'm driving home at 3am and the streets are absolutely deserted, it is mostly the idea of getting a ticket stopping me from doing 15km/h+ over whereas during the day/anytime people and cars are out and about I slow down more out of a regard for safety than anything else.

[BiGBanG]

They're supposed to put the "R" right beside the speed on the ticket.

+1

Ya, there is an "R" on the speeding ticket itself on my dad's ticket that he got last year, still waiting for a court date!

[BiGBanG]

If you got the ticket in Toronto I know how you can get out of it (66% chance by my results)....it is time intensive though! Worst case scenerio is you end up having to plead guilty and pay $20 in court costs....but it also delays the ticket by about a year so it's worth it.

Here's how I did it:

I ticked option 3 on the ticket, had to go request a court date in person. I waited about 6 months and they sent me a court date in the mail (ticket in October, courtdate in July) this is a pretty average timeline for Toronto. When you get the letter informing you of your court date wait about 3 weeks to a month to go to the courthouse and request "discolsure" (this is the evidence they have against you, basically the cop's notes and it's free to get). Toronto is so backlogged majority of the time they take months to get you your discolsure. I requested mine in mid May and they called me in August to pick it up!

Here's the tricky part....court time! It depends on your prosacutor, but I asked mine if I could get another date (adjurnment) as I had not recieved my disclosure. Prosacutor said "ok". I get called up infront of the judge, proscutor says "request for dismissal as disclosure has not been given" and bam, ticket is tossed.

This has worked for me and a friend. One friend had his court date adjurned to another date, so he was dead in the water. He had a simular story to you, 20km over but cop gave him a 10km ticket. 2nd court date he asked to plead guilty to the ticket, his $50 fine was reduced to $20....tack on the $20 in court costs he saved himself $10 and he ate up a year and a half of time.

Make sure you keep all paper work, especially your request for discolsure.


Very good advice!

[ericssonfan]

i think you should always fight your tickets.. Just in case the officer who issued you the ticket doesn't show up for the court date.. Also when you show up at your court date, there's usually a lineup to speak to the prosecutor beforehand and he usually bargains you down if you want to accept a lesser infraction.. Sometimes they'll offer you something that will just involve you paying a fine with no demerit points.
I have a friend that works somewhere within auto insurance and he told me keep away from losing points and also accidents have a much much higher effect on rising insurance.... Also the majority of crazy driving records come from middle age males.. I guess they take out their midlife crises out on the road. haha

[ericssonfan]

I got screwed over getting off the DVP southbound at Bayview/Bloor exit a while back.. Some cube van was tailing my ass right off the highway, and as soon as the lanes opened up with swerved to the next lane and gunned it.. I saw the cop with his laser gun and laughed at the sucker driving the van and the cop pulled both of us over.. I was going 80 (cruisin with my foot off the gas pedal) since I was off the highway and was gonna let the car cruise down to 60 (speed limit).. My defense was gonna be that if I slowed to 60 from 80, the van would have rearended me... But the cop then comes and says I'm just gonna give you a 5km/h over.. WTF.. So what am I gonna say then?? Man... So i paid that ticket, and nothing unusual has showed up on my insurance.

[05Mazda3GT]

So, now I have a lot to think about. I guess if I go to court and lose then the worst thats going to happen is I will have to pay the ticket anyways.

BTW: I should have mentioned this in my first post that it was reduced from 35km/h over down to 15! Just something to think about.

[ericssonfan]

From my 2 experiences from being at court, correct me if I'm wrong but the prosecutor will give mostly everybody a bargain down probably to speed everything up as most ppl who were planning to plead guilty will take the bargain anyways.. In your case, probably reduced to 10km/h over. Another thing, the ticket will only have what the cop issued you and not what it was marked down from.. so unless the cop makes a mental note or note on the side, when you go to court it'll show up as 15, not that it was orginally 35km/h over reduced to 15km/h over already.

Or just hope the cop won't even show, then you get away scot free.

[DingBat]

Virtually everyone here says fight the ticket. I'm going to be unpopular and take the opposite stand.

Look, you did the speed. Man up and pay the fine. This system may allow you to "game" the ticket and get it tossed out, but basically all your doing is passing on the costs to all the taxpayers of Ontario. We're supposed to learn through mistakes but if the mistake is cost free there's no incentive.

Insurance rate increases is nature's way of telling you to slow down.

So, stop wasting everyone's time and money and pay the damn fine already.

[Burner]

Virtually everyone here says fight the ticket. I'm going to be unpopular and take the opposite stand.

Look, you did the speed. Man up and pay the fine. This system may allow you to "game" the ticket and get it tossed out, but basically all your doing is passing on the costs to all the taxpayers of Ontario. We're supposed to learn through mistakes but if the mistake is cost free there's no incentive.

Insurance rate increases is nature's way of telling you to slow down.

So, stop wasting everyone's time and money and pay the damn fine already.

I've heard the ridiculous insurance rates in Ontario called a lot of things, but nature's way? :loco

Fight it, fight it, fight it! The JP's and the crown attorneys get paid whether you fight your ticket or not. The cop will work overtime whenever he/she wants anyways. You're simply not costing taxpayers a penny more by fighting a traffic infraction that gives a private financial company carte blanche to charge you more for the same service.

DingBat, if you're so worried about how your tax dollars are being spent, I hope you're at the next march in Queens Park or on Parliament Hill protesting the BILLIONS in government waste.

[m_bisson]

They're supposed to put the "R" right beside the speed on the ticket.

incorrect.

[htc***]

Fight it, fight it, fight it! The JP's and the crown attorneys get paid whether you fight your ticket or not. The cop will work overtime whenever he/she wants anyways. You're simply not costing taxpayers a penny more by fighting a traffic infraction that gives a private financial company carte blanche to charge you more for the same service.

+1

[Burner]

incorrect.

Hopefully you get a ticket today and have it reduced. Then you'll see for yourself.

[DingBat]

DingBat, if you're so worried about how your tax dollars are being spent, I hope you're at the next march in Queens Park or on Parliament Hill protesting the BILLIONS in government waste.

I'm not particular, I hate all waste. Including people wasting others time and energy when they're guilty.

So, just for interest's sake, is there ANY speeding ticket that you would just pay? Maybe we should just do away with speeding tickets altogether?

[Burner]

I'm not particular, I hate all waste. Including people wasting others time and energy when they're guilty.

So, just for interest's sake, is there ANY speeding ticket that you would just pay? Maybe we should just do away with speeding tickets altogether?

As long as privately owned insurance companies have access to my record to find excuses to raise my rates, I'll fight every moving violation I receive to the bitter end. I don't have a problem paying the ticket really. It's the thousands in extra insurance premiums over the years that bother me. Especially considering that with the amount I've put into insurance over the years, I could have bought myself a brand new MS3 with cash.