Lug nuts are loosening off !!!! Help please

[Peter]

Ok so I'm running the same tuner nuts as my winter rims and they have never loosened off. I Plasti dipped my stock speed rims, Im using the same nuts as my winter set up. I put these bolts on for one day and 20min before I started this thread became so loosened had to pull over and tighten them by hand. Everything is now running smooth. As it did the first time. This is the secOnd time this has happened.

So is it the painted wheels doing this or the tuner nuts won't run with the stock wheels, and should I just use the stock nuts with the stock wheels.

[eqlso]

Just a shot in the dark, but did you have hubcentric rings before? Check that they're not stuck there on the hub when you put on the stock rims.

[terapr0]

yea, I've heard of that happening before too...definitely worth checking

[Peter]

Just a shot in the dark, but did you have hubcentric rings before? Check that they're not stuck there on the hub when you put on the stock rims.

No the rings are off.

[Noisy Crow]

Don't tuner nuts and stock ones have different profiles?

[Peter]

Don't tuner nuts and stock ones have different profiles?

I think tuner nuts are just thinner profile am same thread type as my stock so I unno what's going on here.

[Peter]

So I just got off the phone with two different mechanics told me both to use my stock nuts with the stock wheels. Anyone here can confirm this. Or any other thoughts

[Noisy Crow]

I think tuner nuts are just thinner profile am same thread type as my stock so I unno what's going on here.

Not the threads, but the angle and shape of the seat is different.

[zzz3]

So I just got off the phone with two different mechanics told me both to use my stock nuts with the stock wheels. Anyone here can confirm this. Or any other thoughts

I've heard this before as well. The same applies vice versa, use tuner nuts with aftermarket wheels only.

Also your not supposed to use wheel locks with steelies, not sure if there is any truth to that though.

[Peter]

Not the threads, but the angle and shape of the seat is different.

So different wheels different lug nuts are needed then ?

[fumoffu]

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/4206/acornmagballseats.jpg

I know some tuner nuts are not design to spec and do not sit well. (I remember someone was saying about this on Mazda 3 forum but cant say for sure)
The lug nuts might have a different degree than 60.
Not sure...

Go look for different lug nuts and test to see if this occur or not.

[SonicBoy]

Was just about to post what fumoffu did.

Also, hope you don't use anit-seize on the studs.

[Peter]

Was just about to post what fumoffu did.

Also, hope you don't use anit-seize on the studs.
No I dident

[kickz]

is your torque wrench set to the right ft/lbs?

[Fobio]

Did you also plastic dip the backing of the wheel where it meets the hub? I have a feeling it's nice and thick there.

[Peter]

Did you also plastic dip the backing of the wheel where it meets the hub? I have a feeling it's nice and thick there.

It's all pretty much striped off, I put on the stock ones so we will see if it will make a difference. I'll post results later. Thanks for the info guys.

[Default User]

Take a look at the seat on the summer lugs vs the OEM lugs.

One is probably tapered

[Fobio]

Aftermarket "tuner lugs" vs. OEM style

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-t4V8G9Xe4JY/SKD2amkkdDI/AAAAAAAABCU/F4YVVSVu_7Q/s640/IMG_0016.JPG

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gQLdKajtNOY/SKD2befIC_I/AAAAAAAABCc/P0wMIFnGDYw/s576/IMG_0017.JPG

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-F_j3eJXF8dI/SKD2cxtarmI/AAAAAAAABCs/_uV6UT3mkIE/s576/IMG_0019.JPG

[gar_lei]

I've used tuner lugs, rays lugs, project kics lugs on OEM and they never fail. I always put a tiny little bit of anti seize and tighten them to 80lbs then retighten after 50KM of driving and I'm good to go for the season

[Kiyomi]

how tight do you put them on ft lbs?

[fumoffu]

hmmmmm

On steelie you do not have to re tight them after putting the 80 ft lb on each lugs but make sure it is torque to spec. For most alloy, you torque it and re-torque after 100km ish.

[Booter22]

the tuner lugs i have tried on my mx5 rims dont fit, or the mazdaspeed lug set wont work on my oem wheels. they do both work on the DAI candy wheels but the oem lugs do not work with those rims. i would suspect its the tuner lugs on the oem rims, and best i remember at this time of the day they should be torqued to 95 ftlbs for speeds and 105 ftlbs for mazda 3s. ( could be wrong.. after all its 6:30 am :P)

[Peter]

the tuner lugs i have tried on my mx5 rims dont fit, or the mazdaspeed lug set wont work on my oem wheels. they do both work on the DAI candy wheels but the oem lugs do not work with those rims. i would suspect its the tuner lugs on the oem rims, and best i remember at this time of the day they should be torqued to 95 ftlbs for speeds and 105 ftlbs for mazda 3s. ( could be wrong.. after all its 6:30 am :P)


There torqued to whatever my body weight was lastnight. So far no issues. Lots of things to consider here.
On another note anyone here, know if the warrentys covers defected tires , I never hit a curve with these stick tires and noticed lastnight I have two bulgess or bumps you know what I'm talking about. There on the inside of the tire so toward the hub side soni can't even see them when u look from the outside u have to take the wheels off to see. Any thoughts.

[fumoffu]

sound like you got tumor tires. Sould be cover warranty.

[Noisy Crow]

best i remember at this time of the day they should be torqued to 95 ftlbs for speeds and 105 ftlbs for mazda 3s. ( could be wrong.. after all its 6:30 am :P)

Go back to bed John!

Spec. is 65-87 ft-lbs according to the service manual for the '08 3. 105 ft-lbs seems a tad high..... maybe you are thinking N-m?

[Booter22]

Go back to bed John!

Spec. is 65-87 ft-lbs according to the service manual for the '08 3. 105 ft-lbs seems a tad high..... maybe you are thinking N-m?

lol yep your right, the spec page says - Lug nut tightening torque
(N·m {kgf·m, ft·lbf})
88—118 {9.0—12, 65—87}

[TheMAN]

There torqued to whatever my body weight was lastnight. So far no issues. Lots of things to consider here.
On another note anyone here, know if the warrentys covers defected tires , I never hit a curve with these stick tires and noticed lastnight I have two bulgess or bumps you know what I'm talking about. There on the inside of the tire so toward the hub side soni can't even see them when u look from the outside u have to take the wheels off to see. Any thoughts.

then you don't know how tight they are... the problem with this is, with uneven torque on all 5 lug nuts, it will cause brake rotors to warp... please do yourself a favour and buy a $20 torque wrench... it'll be one of the best things spent for your car!
however, I don't think "gutntite" has anything to do with your lug nuts backing off... just like some others here said, I think the issue are the seat type of the lug nuts... the OEM ones have small taper seat while the tuner ones have a large 60 degree taper
using the wrong lug nuts is very dangerous and can damage the wheels!

[Punkrockjohn]

then you don't know how tight they are... the problem with this is, with uneven torque on all 5 lug nuts, it will cause brake rotors to warp... please do yourself a favour and buy a $20 torque wrench... it'll be one of the best things spent for your car!
however, I don't think "gutntite" has anything to do with your lug nuts backing off... just like some others here said, I think the issue are the seat type of the lug nuts... the OEM ones have small taper seat while the tuner ones have a large 60 degree taper
using the wrong lug nuts is very dangerous and can damage the wheels!

+1

[Peter]

I have a torque gun well so far the stock ones are holding up.

[TheMAN]

wtf is a "torque gun"?

[fumoffu]

Impact wrench.

[Peter]

Impact wrench.

Sorry that's right , tired here guys working running around since 6am haven't seen my house yet.

[Peter]

then you don't know how tight they are... the problem with this is, with uneven torque on all 5 lug nuts, it will cause brake rotors to warp... please do yourself a favour and buy a $20 torque wrench... it'll be one of the best things spent for your car!
however, I don't think "gutntite" has anything to do with your lug nuts backing off... just like some others here said, I think the issue are the seat type of the lug nuts... the OEM ones have small taper seat while the tuner ones have a large 60 degree taper
using the wrong lug nuts is very dangerous and can damage the wheels!


The thing is the tuner nuts where torqued so I think just stock with stock then.

[TheMAN]

impact wrenches are NOT torque wrenches... there is no preset torque and you will never know how tight you get whatever fastener you are tightening, just like you won't know how tight a bolt is if you just tighten by feel
the only way you can get to a predetermined torque level is with torque sticks when using impact wrenches... and they're expensive

like I already said... go to sears, buy that $20 torque wrench and USE IT!

just because lots of shops blast lug nuts on (without torque sticks), doesn't mean it's the right thing to do... they all think they can do the same thing they see the NASCAR guys do

[Unoriginalusername]

Also, hope you don't use anit-seize on the studs.

? why

[fumoffu]

Lug nuts are handled differently at almost every garage. If you've experienced a lug that is extremely hard to loosen they were likely tightened with an impact tool. There is a device called a torque stick which can make pneumatic tools much more effective at avoiding over-torque. In most every shop, I see impact tools used, while I often do not see torque sticks. Tire rack.

Would make sense. Never used a impact wrench to apply the torque spec since it in not recommended. Also used a proper torque wrench.

Get one!

[Noisy Crow]

? why

Reduced friction --> more stretching of the studs for a given torque --> broken studs when they are torqued to specified amount. You can compensate by using reduced torque, but the trick is: by how much? And still have your wheels safely attached?

[Peter]

impact wrenches are NOT torque wrenches... there is no preset torque and you will never know how tight you get whatever fastener you are tightening, just like you won't know how tight a bolt is if you just tighten by feel
the only way you can get to a predetermined torque level is with torque sticks when using impact wrenches... and they're expensive

like I already said... go to sears, buy that $20 torque wrench and USE IT!

just because lots of shops blast lug nuts on (without torque sticks), doesn't mean it's the right thing to do... they all think they can do the same thing they see the NASCAR guys do

well this one does i used it on my winter set up and my stock lug nuts and no issues , so like i said thses tuner nuts must work with the OEM rims, witch is fine, the crome does not look all that bad.

[zzz3]

hey peter, i got a torque wrench you can use. also since you can't use your blue lugs, can i have them :chuckle

mine are fading, let me know how much if you don't want them...

[SonicBoy]

? why

Studs should only be cleaned with a wire brush according to the shop manuals and also articles up on tire rack. There is a chance the anti-seize could cause the lug/nut to back off.

If you're really bored, take a look at this discussion. <clicky> (http://www.engineersedge.com/wwwboard/posts/13070.html)

[Unoriginalusername]

Studs should only be cleaned with a wire brush according to the shop manuals and also articles up on tire rack. There is a chance the anti-seize could cause the lug/nut to back off.

If you're really bored, take a look at this discussion. <clicky> (http://www.engineersedge.com/wwwboard/posts/13070.html)

thanks, been using the anti-sieze for years so i was curious. i do check my pressures and lug tightness regularly though

[Peter]

Been 2 days no issues so far :D now if I can only fin out if I can get my tires replaced free , I'll be set :D

[m_bisson]

Been 2 days no issues so far :D now if I can only fin out if I can get my tires replaced free , I'll be set :D

Go get them torqued properly or I can guarantee some issues will arise.


As for the anti-seize, there's no point in using it unless you have chronic problems with a stud/nut every time you try to remove it. Buy a breaker bar instead.

[midnightfxgt]

Been 2 days no issues so far :D now if I can only fin out if I can get my tires replaced free , I'll be set :D

You hit a curb and have sidewall buldges? If so, very slim chance at Warranty, as that's not a defect.