Stock HID highbeams vs -29°C malfunction?

[kheaz]

Hi, I'm a new member but I consult this forum each time something weird happens.

Does anyone have ever seen a stock HID high beams VS cold problem on a 2010 mazda 3 GT? I have the HID beams (bi-xenon) that turn with the steering wheel.

Yesterday, my car was parked in a (probably) heated public parking. The first 15 minutes of drive were in town, then the next 30 minutes were on highway at -29°C. For that time, there was no problem, low VS high beams worked fine. Then after that, for no reason whatsoever, high beams stopped working. The DEL that indicate you are on high beams did not work. I tried every combination of OFF, AUTO or with the forced low lights to high. The low beam (which is the same bulb as high) was normal. The lights still turned when I turned the steering wheel.

Then, this morning, (car was parked outside for the night and the temperature stayed around -30°C) everything was fine.

I spoke with my dealership and he has never seen or heard of that. But he didn't even know HID low/high beams was the same bulb, he thought it was the daylights that turned to high. So is that a bug from the computer, a condensation problem, or something else less obvious? Of course dealership service guy has to see it before he takes any action and anyway it works now.

Oh, and I had the stock sealed beams changed last summer by the dealership under warranty because they were whitening.

Thanks!

[greyseason]

Okay i think you mean to say that your DRL (daytime running lights) are working but your High beams are not? DRL/High beam share the same bulb while the low beam (the lights that come on at dusk) are a different bulb and are not working properly. Is that right?

[kheaz]

Sorry for the bad terms / confusion.

DRL were working fine.
Low beam (HID) were working fine. in both auto and on mode.
High beam (HID, same bulb as Low beam) were not working on all modes (since you can signal while on DRL). The blue high beam LED on the dashboard didn't work.

My High and Low beam share the same HID bulb. I have a different bulb (always turned off at night) for DRL only. The Mazda service guy also thought HID were for Low beam only and DRL was for daytime and high beam. When I turn, both low and high beam turn following the steering wheel. If you don't believe me I'll post pictures tonight.

It was so cold that the clutch (6 speed MT) was really hard when I got off the highway. I drove 115 km/h on the cruise control for about 50 minutes at -29°C. The not working part happened on the last 15-20 minutes of highway. At home it still didn't work, but I can't remember if I tried while the car was stopped.

My conclusion so far is a computer bug which was cleared by the car stop / start cycle.

[greyseason]

Someone correct me if im wrong but the DRL/High beams share the same light. HID high beams dont make sense since they need to warm up/only work at one wattage compared to DRL(night lights)/high beam bulbs where DRL is 35w and Highbeam is 55w when on.

So HID in the DRL make sense since they are always on UNLESS your lowbeams(night lights) are on

[jeffjones]

Someone correct me if im wrong but the DRL/High beams share the same light. HID high beams dont make sense since they need to warm up/only work at one wattage compared to DRL(night lights)/high beam bulbs where DRL is 35w and Highbeam is 55w when on.

So HID in the DRL make sense since they are always on UNLESS your lowbeams(night lights) are on


I believe what he is saying is true, The DRL is a halogen while the Hi/Lo that is HID (Bi-Xenon).

Although I am not familiar on how your hid goes from hi/lo (Could be a telescopic bulb, could be a shield in the projector.....)
I believe in the projectors the shield that creates the sharp cut off line is moved to allow the light to become a hi beam.

[Johns 08 3 GT]

The HID is low beam only. The DRL is the high beam (half power) The HID's stay on when the high beams come on.

[greyseason]

The HID is low beam only. The DRL is the high beam (half power) The HID's stay on when the high beams come on.

That's right! Sorry OP for the confusion

[kheaz]

I'm starting to think there may be two possibilities, since the Mazda service guy was sure it was greyseason's reasoning.

I'll post pictures tonight.

[jeffjones]

The HID is low beam only. The DRL is the high beam (half power) The HID's stay on when the high beams come on.

If you look up an 10' mazda 3 GT w/HID's on a bulb selection guide you will see the DRL is an H8 while the Hi and Lo beam is a D2S bulb.


http://i1191.photobucket.com/albums/z464/mccall187/Capture_zpsda8d8b6d.jpg (http://s1191.photobucket.com/user/mccall187/media/Capture_zpsda8d8b6d.jpg.html)

[Johns 08 3 GT]

The HID bulb does not split wattage for DRL. The reason your headlights were replaced is the DRL (high beam bulb) was getting too hot.

[jeffjones]

The HID bulb does not split wattage for DRL. The reason your headlights were replaced is the DRL (high beam bulb) was getting too hot.

No one said the HID splits wattage, I believe there is a shield in the projector that moves changing the light output from Lo beam to Hi beam. There is zero change in wattage or voltage between the Hi and Lo beam.

[kheaz]

Although I am not familiar on how your hid goes from hi/lo (Could be a telescopic bulb, could be a shield in the projector.....)
I believe in the projectors the shield that creates the sharp cut off line is moved to allow the light to become a hi beam.

This. I also have no idea. But it probably implies moving parts. Maybe that specific moving part got frozen after some condensation from humidity in the underground public parking formed when I exited it? This would mean the dash blue LED knows when the moving part doesn't work.

The only other option I see is a computer bug out of nowhere.

[The Wolf]

dp

[The Wolf]

The HID is low beam only. The DRL is the high beam (half power) The HID's stay on when the high beams come on.

this is not the case with the bi-xenon headlights. They look like this:
http://www.fastmotoring.com/oldfiles/2009/6/Photo_0070.jpg
The DRL is a separate bulb and is only used for DRL. both Low and High beams are HID with this version.


The standard light, which everyone but the OP and jeffjones are talking about looks like this:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_dPZHoY1yQic/TPVILgqqwjI/AAAAAAAAAuU/ZkF8b3ZpK24/s1600/mazda%2B3%2Bdemon%2Beyes%2B3.jpg


They are different systems.

[kheaz]

Thanks for the clarification, The Wolf!

Now, has anyone ever heard of a problem specific (to my configuration and) to the high beam not working while the low one works, for a short period of time and out of nowhere? Could the system which controls the hi/lo beam freeze in extreme cold weather (-30°C )? If so, somehow there is a feedback to the computer since the dash LED also stopped working. But that explication would not explain why it unfroze when I started the car the next morning, which was as cold.

The other option would be that something went wrong in the system and the car's computer detected it and decided to disable the Hi beam, thus disabling the LED dash indicator. Then the car stop/restart cycle would have cleared that event.

Or has anyone have seen something similar?

Thanks!

[Johns 08 3 GT]

I guess it would have helped if I read the car year. My bad. :bang

[Kev888]

Someone have an update on this? I have the exact same problem on my 2013 Mazdaspeed, except that when I start the car in very very cold conditions (-30 or less), the low beam and even the parking lights come on after approx 2-3 minutes. When I'm on highway, I put my headlight lever in High beam position and wait 'til the high beams come on (usualy about 5-6 minutes).

This happens only in very cold conditions. My guess is that relays are freezing.

[Reddie1337]

Well, inside the headlight is a little shutter that flips down, the only thing I could see is if your shutter is frozen. Because the stock HID's being all 1 bulb for high and low, it should only stop light output from shinning higher. Are you saying that your whole headlight doesn't turn on right away? Kev888

[Kev888]

Well most of the time it's just the high beams that didn't come on, but when temperatures are under -35°C the low beams and the parking lights stop working too.

My guess goes to the relay as the high beam cluster indicator does not come on either. I'm actually searching for the headlights wiring diagrams to see if there's a relay that power the projector shutter.

[Hyperion]

Hence Bi-Xenon guys.....
Sorry I didn't see this thread earlier to clear that up earlier.

It's not the flap actuator that would cause the light not to go on, the light should go on regardless if the flap goes down.

The only way to diagnose it, is
1) Bring it to a dealer over night on a cold night and have them diagnose it in the morning if it doesn't work
2) Buy a voltmeter and when it's not working, see if power it getting to the bulbs. If it's getting to the bulbs, it's the bulb that's the issue. Work your way back towards the ballast and then, the plug to connect the headlight harness to the car harness.

I'd put a my bet that the ballast doesn't like -35 degree's, as that's really cold.
Next guess would be as was stated before, a frozen relay, as that too is a moving metal part.

[TheMAN]

you DON'T want to use a volt meter to test the ballast or its output... did you not read what the warning labels says on the ballast/headlights? HID bulbs needs thousands of volts to start, which is what the ballast *should* keep trying to do until it gives up after some predetermined time

[Hyperion]

Well then he can swap for new bulbs to see if it's the bulbs, if it doesn't work, it's the ballast, and he can still check if the ballast is getting power by testing the wires before it.

Nevertheless, it's probably cuz it's cold as balls.

[Kev888]

When it happens, the only thing that didn't work is the shutter. Low beams are still working fine. I will check this weekend if power goes to the shutter.

[TheMAN]

probably the shutter mechanism is frozen... it works by electromagnet