View Full Version : Car VS Bicycle Question
The Wolf
06-12-2014, 08:34 AM
So a thing happened to me the other day and had me thinking.
*
The intersection in question is quite busy with vehicle and pedestrian traffic typically. At the corner, there is kind of a public square where a paved trail provides access to a public park.*
Anyway, I checked and there were no pedestrians waiting to cross and no cars coming from the left, so I went ahead and began my turn. I had just pulled over the crosswalk when a dude on a mountain bike came FLYING through the crowd of people and onto the crosswalk. He was coming from the park, not down the sidewalk (hence my not seeing him) and on the wrong side of the road for a cyclist. He sees me turning last second and hits the brakes and flips over his bars onto the road.*
He was uninjured but he got up screaming at me about not looking where I was driving.
My question is, since he's a cyclist who was crossing on the pedestrian crosswalk on his wrong side of the road, would I be at fault in this situation? I understand it's my responsibility to make sure it's clear before turning but I feel like he would have been at fault.
MannyVieira
06-12-2014, 08:50 AM
Tricky one. However if he's not going to walk his bike across the road then i mean hes asking to fall off that bike. Alot of bikers cant make up their minds to either stay on the road or side walk and think they can prance around anywhere they please, he should have been on the road not the crosswalk with a helmet of course.
greyseason
06-12-2014, 08:56 AM
I enjoy bicycling and used to bike every single day, but bikers think they own the goddamn road. A bicyclist needs to be paying MORE attention than the people on the road. Not saying people in cars/trucks shouldnt be paying attention, but we have a car, and air bags to help in the event of a accident, bicyclist slide.
I dont think you would be at fault if you explained that to an officer
Yeah I dont think you would be at fault because it sounds like he was going against traffic. In a case with a bike, an officer may even make a call of 50/50...
m_bisson
06-12-2014, 09:28 AM
Nah, the cop would just tell everyone to go home.
Pedestrians have the right of way. They also have the right to use some goddamn common sense.
Sonic31
06-12-2014, 09:39 AM
I agree, I don't think you're at fault.
You followed the rules of the road, stopped, looked, proceeded with caution (I'm also assuming you signaled). You had already visually cleared the intersection and started to move. In my mind at that point you had right of way.
My personal rule of thumb is, if the bike is on the sidewalk it's a pedestrian and needs to follow their rules, i.e. walk across intersections.
lazycro
06-12-2014, 09:59 AM
See below, bicyclist is at fault:
As a cyclist, you must share the road with others (e.g., cars, buses, trucks, motorcycles, etc.).
Under Ontario’s Highway Traffic Act (HTA), a bicycle is a vehicle, just like a car or truck. Cyclists:
must obey all traffic laws
have the same rights and responsibilities as drivers
cannot carry passengers — if your bicycle is only meant for one person.
Riding on the right
You must stay as close to the right edge of the road whenever possible, especially if you’re slower than other traffic.
Where you can ride
You can ride on most roads, except:
controlled access highways, such as Ontario’s 400-series highways
across a road within a pedestrian cross-over - you must walk your bike to the other side.
Innovator
06-12-2014, 10:18 AM
I would say the guy on the bike is at fault for that one. Going against traffic while riding a bike at a high speed. He was not following the rules of the road for bicyclists. Toronto has so many issues with this year after year. People in cars hate people on bikes and people of bikes hate people in cars. There are arguments all the time. Not sure how the Loo is for providing bike lanes etc on the busier roots but most cities should really start focusing on making more space and lanes for bikes which should help both sides.
SomeGuy
06-12-2014, 10:25 AM
At least he flipped over his handlebars...that would have been good for a laugh lol
Slade
06-12-2014, 10:27 AM
Did you capture it on a dash cam?
Bikes belong on the road, we do not use the crosswalk to beat lights...
Timotee
06-12-2014, 10:53 AM
You did your due diligence and his actions, in my opinion, led to his own predicament.
Typical reaction from someone who fell and kissed the pavement, lesson learned for him.
He was uninjured but he got up screaming at me about not looking where I was driving.
SirWanker
06-12-2014, 11:08 AM
Another vote for the "cyclist was a twit for not adjusting to the road conditions".
S.F.W.
06-12-2014, 11:37 AM
CloudPump - say the cyclist runs into your car, dents the bumper and scratches and dents the hood. How does auto insurance see this ?
CloudPump
06-12-2014, 12:15 PM
You'll be unhappy with the result.
-Geoff
greyseason
06-12-2014, 12:19 PM
You'll be unhappy with the result.
-Geoff
thats bullshit. I know you have nothing to do with that, its not directed at you at all its just, if its considered a motor vehicle, and they damage your vehicle, they should pay.
Its funny, when i was a biker i saw things differently, but now that i dont as much, man do some have terrible habits. I can only imagine what people thought of me
Dave_The_BMXER
06-12-2014, 12:31 PM
I've actually done what you described (on a bike) I was on the sidewalk and a car pulled out from a townhouse complex across the sidewalk and I smoked the side of the car. I got up apologetic and I felt really bad because technically I should have been on the road (ironically I don't ride on roads in Mississauga because I don't want to get hit by a car) and I basically destroyed his passenger door.
Cyclist in this case is at fault AND a douche.
In my case the same thing happened to his son so he drove me home and we called it a day. He was just glad I wasn't dead.
SirWanker
06-12-2014, 12:46 PM
@CloudPump (http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/member.php?u=21951) - say the cyclist runs into your car, dents the bumper and scratches and dents the hood. How does auto insurance see this ?
You'll be unhappy with the result.
-Geoff
thats bullshit. I know you have nothing to do with that, its not directed at you at all its just, if its considered a motor vehicle, and they damage your vehicle, they should pay.
no fault insurance....
greyseason
06-12-2014, 12:47 PM
no fault insurance....
true dat actually
Kiewan
06-12-2014, 01:36 PM
He DIDN'T hit the car right? His problem. If he hit you, then ya.
The Wolf
06-12-2014, 02:26 PM
He didn't hit me, but the question was posed assuming he did hit me or was injured.
Mitchell3
06-12-2014, 03:10 PM
His fault imo. I may be biased though because I absolutely hate bicyclists
SO many bike riders are a-holes. There are some people that drive and make a mistake/illegal move and are then apologetic. Every bike I've seen who does the same flips their shit at innocent bystanders. I personally love the ones that are on the road that magically transform into pedestrians that use crosswalks when the lights are red. Pick one or the other so your at least predictable. Or there's the ones who pass in single file zones. Ill stop now before I get into a rant.
Seriously though, when has a bicyclist ever said sorry my bad? Never.
SirWanker
06-12-2014, 03:21 PM
His fault imo. I may be biased though because I absolutely hate bicyclists
SO many bike riders are a-holes. There are some people that drive and make a mistake/illegal move and are then apologetic. Every bike I've seen who does the same flips their shit at innocent bystanders. I personally love the ones that are on the road that magically transform into pedestrians that use crosswalks when the lights are red. Pick one or the other so your at least predictable. Or there's the ones who pass in single file zones. Ill stop now before I get into a rant.
Seriously though, when has a bicyclist ever said sorry my bad? Never.
As are many drivers.....come to think of it, I'm starting to see drivers pull the same j@ck@$$ stunts as those irresponsible cyclists.
Mitchell3
06-12-2014, 03:31 PM
As are many drivers.....come to think of it, I'm starting to see drivers pull the same j@ck@$$ stunts as those irresponsible cyclists.
I haven't seen much of that. In my experience we have the a-hole cyclists up here in Canada. Its when I drive in the states that all the a-hole drivers come out. I've been honked at and given dirty looks for simply merging..
Mind you I'm not in Toronto, its worse up there than in small KW.
optiklenz13
06-12-2014, 04:24 PM
Only the roadies are a*holes..
:chuckle
:gone
staax
06-12-2014, 04:29 PM
Until I read lazycro's post I would've said you were at fault, yet I totally agree with your argument. There are a ton of bikers that think they own the road and it drives me crazy.
In this case though, its clear it was the biker's fault.
Kiewan
06-12-2014, 04:31 PM
I know this is regarding a right hand turn, but when going along a road, give them lots of room and watch your blind spots downtown. Some act the way they do because they know if anything bad happens to them, they can try and F$$$ you over through insurance, but most just want to get where they're going in one piece.
Need bike lanes in TO on the major routes.
ZeroChalk
06-12-2014, 05:15 PM
I know this is regarding a right hand turn, but when going along a road, give them lots of room and watch your blind spots downtown. Some act the way they do because they know if anything bad happens to them, they can try and F$$$ you over through insurance, but most just want to get where they're going in one piece.
Need bike lanes in TO on the major routes.
I bike a lot - both in the city and out on country roads.
In defense of cyclists, a lot of them are idiots who have disregard for traffic laws and don't know the rules of the road. At the same time, it can also be said of drivers as well. I've seen cars squeeze out cyclists and I've been witness to road rage in which a pickup truck purposely tried to run me off the road. The only way I see things improving is through ticketing and awareness programs. With that said, cycling is an excellent way to get around downtown and keeps you in shape. You have to be proactive (take the lane if necessary) and defensive where and when you ride.
The Wolf
06-12-2014, 06:59 PM
I have nothing against cyclists. I bike around a bunch. I usually keep on the streets and try to follow the rules of the road, but for someone inexperienced it can be hard to remember that you can't just do whatever you want haha. My only real issue is on the hilly rural roads around Waterloo, when they ride 5 or 6 wide up a hill and let traffic back up behind them.
Thanks all for the responses. :)
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