Upgrading bass - how much and where to start?

[ice512]

Hi all,

Till this day (1 year after picking up the car), I still can't believe how weak the bass is from the Bose sound system. I'm not looking to do anything crazy, I was perfectly happy with the bass that was coming from my stock 2011 Golf.

How much do I have to spend approx. and where/how would I start? Should I look at replacing speakers? Replacing the subs? Adding an AMP?

All I know is replacing the head unit isn't really an option since it comes with GPS/Phone connection.

Thanks in advance!!

[trulankan]

be prepared to spend at least $500 (new) at a minimum if you want a decent single sub setup with amp installed. wait until one of the sponsors has a sale and then buy everything. you will save money if you know how to install it yourself (i didn't lol). it really depends on your budget. you can also save a ton by buying used from other members or kijiji. i started off with the sub and amp and then replaced my door speakers with aftermarket when they went on sale. it made a huuggeee difference in sound quality. i'm not sure how the Bose speakers are but i'm sure they are much better than the cheap oem paper crap so you might be fine keeping them in.

[Jackal]

I hear that replacing speakers and sub on the Bose system is more complicated.

[ice512]

be prepared to spend at least $500 (new) at a minimum if you want a decent single sub setup with amp installed. wait until one of the sponsors has a sale and then buy everything. you will save money if you know how to install it yourself (i didn't lol). it really depends on your budget. you can also save a ton by buying used from other members or kijiji. i started off with the sub and amp and then replaced my door speakers with aftermarket when they went on sale. it made a huuggeee difference in sound quality. i'm not sure how the Bose speakers are but i'm sure they are much better than the cheap oem paper crap so you might be fine keeping them in.

So if I were to do one thing at a time, which part would you recommend me to start off with first that will make a notable difference? Door speakers?

Sorry I'm completely brand new to this...and whoever I am getting it from, they will be doing the installation for me for sure.

[ice512]

I hear that replacing speakers and sub on the Bose system is more complicated.

Wouldn't be surprised....

[Dubwize]

If you are looking to increase the low end, put in a sub. They are remarkable easy to wire, even to a stock headunit. Considering the vast options in subs and amps, plus buying new or used, you will easily be able to find something within your budget.

[ice512]

If you are looking to increase the low end, put in a sub. They are remarkable easy to wire, even to a stock headunit. Considering the vast options in subs and amps, plus buying new or used, you will easily be able to find something within your budget.

thanks, but the car already comes with a bose sub....so do i replace that one?

[Dubwize]

You don't have too. Unless you want to use that space for your new sub/amp setup. Having the small Bose sub might be irrelevant after you install a new sub though, depending on how large you go with that new sub.

[jaimie08mazda3]

So it all depends on how much you want to spend and how much bass you want. You can spend 500 new on a sub/amp combo easily. Door speakers same thing. I've upgraded my entire stereo from top to bottom and I've got 2 amps for the car (sub and speaker). It did make a huge difference in sound quality but for bass I'd still get even a 10" just to have that oomf. If your planning on keeping the stock deck then you can run a LOC to run an aftermarket sub. Look on kijiji. There are a lot of great deals on stereo equipment and spend half of what you would have new. If you need help I would be more then happy to do so!

[Cab0oze]

I have an awesome sub setup and it cost me $180 including wires and LOC.
12" Rockford Fosgate Punch (P2) w/ 325.1 Amp
Ripped out the OEM BOSE shit

Bass is perfect for someone that likes to enjoy music and feel some bass in your seat, but doesn't care about waking up the whole block

[ice512]

So it all depends on how much you want to spend and how much bass you want. You can spend 500 new on a sub/amp combo easily. Door speakers same thing. I've upgraded my entire stereo from top to bottom and I've got 2 amps for the car (sub and speaker). It did make a huge difference in sound quality but for bass I'd still get even a 10" just to have that oomf. If your planning on keeping the stock deck then you can run a LOC to run an aftermarket sub. Look on kijiji. There are a lot of great deals on stereo equipment and spend half of what you would have new. If you need help I would be more then happy to do so!

Honestly I am not looking to spend much, something less than $300 would be ideal. Again, I am already happy with the sound that's coming from a set of stock Golf speakers, so my expectations are not sky high. I am definitely not looking to replace my whole set up either. My gut feeling tells me replacing my front door speakers or adding a small sub in the trunk would make me happy.

But then again I don't know much about car stereo at all so it might sound like I am talking out of my a$$ ... lol

[ice512]

I have an awesome sub setup and it cost me $180 including wires and LOC.
12" Rockford Fosgate Punch (P2) w/ 325.1 Amp
Ripped out the OEM BOSE shit

Bass is perfect for someone that likes to enjoy music and feel some bass in your seat, but doesn't care about waking up the whole block

Can you tell me if that set would cause your windows and licesne plate vibrate? I wouldn't want anything like that...thanks!!

[Hyperion]

Can you tell me if that set would cause your windows and licesne plate vibrate? I wouldn't want anything like that...thanks!!
Don't turn it up so much :)

[trulankan]

Can you tell me if that set would cause your windows and licesne plate vibrate? I wouldn't want anything like that...thanks!!

if you aren't looking for crazy bass i would stick with a single 10-inch sub (i have one and with the right EQ settings the bass is more than enough for me) and a decent amp to support it. there's even something called the Bazooka which is an all-in-one amp+sub which is cheaper and easier to install.

[ice512]

if you aren't looking for crazy bass i would stick with a single 10-inch sub (i have one and with the right EQ settings the bass is more than enough for me) and a decent amp to support it. there's even something called the Bazooka which is an all-in-one amp+sub which is cheaper and easier to install.

http://www.bazooka.com/products/mobile/Amplified-Bass-Tubes-Subwoofers-C6/BT-Series-S68/BTA6100---BT-Series-6-inch-100-watt-Amplified-Tube-P35
Is this the one ure referring to?

[Dubwize]

Honestly I am not looking to spend much, something less than $300 would be ideal. Again, I am already happy with the sound that's coming from a set of stock Golf speakers, so my expectations are not sky high. I am definitely not looking to replace my whole set up either. My gut feeling tells me replacing my front door speakers or adding a small sub in the trunk would make me happy.

But then again I don't know much about car stereo at all so it might sound like I am talking out of my a$$ ... lol

I would caution against only changing the front speakers, if you want to change your internal speakers do all of them at the same time. Changing just the front to a set of high quality aftermarket speakers and then listening to them at their optimal level, will more then likely kill your other speakers as they won't be able to handle what you are putting into the front ones. They won't blow right away, or anything. but they will wear out quicker, you may also introduce speaker rattle / pops / other unwanted speaker noise into the non upgraded speakers. This would distract from the quality of music as your ears will focus on the noises that aren't supposed to be in the song you're listening to.


Can you tell me if that set would cause your windows and licesne plate vibrate? I wouldn't want anything like that...thanks!!

Yes, A rockford 12" at high levels will rattle/shake the rear quarter panels and license.


Also, Bazooka is kinda a catch all term for any amplified speaker tube. Yes they have specific models called Bazooka, but if you find any tube you can call it that. IMO, they are not worth it. Yes they are cheap, usually small enough to not kill all your trunk/hatch room. But the cons are... the they're cheap, the sub quality is cheap, the amp quality is cheap. They normally have a very low output wattage. Better to pair a amp with a sub. This method has better resale value down the road also.

Here is a great online store for doing amp and sub compares. they have huge selections so it's easy to get idea's for what you want.
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/cat_i22_car-amplifiers.html

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/cat_i39_car-subwoofers.html

I would suggest looking in 10" range of subs. 12" subs move more air, so they create more big bass. 10" subs tend to have a cleaner punch.

[Cab0oze]

Can you tell me if that set would cause your windows and licesne plate vibrate? I wouldn't want anything like that...thanks!!
Not it doesn't, at least not with my settings. if you cranked it, probably... Keep in mind though, this isn't one of those stupid powerful 1200W sub/amps, this is 300W. I really just mentioned my setup because all those crazies above me are saying minimum 500$. You can get what you want for WAAAAY less than that if you're on a budget.

Note- My other sub was a 10" RF that I had in my old mz3 sedan. The 12" produced much cleaner bass. Although now that I think about it I wasn't using the same amp, but I kinda doubt that had anything to do with it.

[Dubwize]

Rockford makes low wattage sub's??? Lol. I assumed it was one of the big ones. Even at 300w though you could have rattle.

The quality of your amp will most definitely have an effect on your sound. Look for amps that are CEA-2006 compliant. This means they have been tested by a third party to meet the specifics the manufacturer is claiming it can. ie RMS, peak wattage, SNR, crossover freq etc

[Cab0oze]

Rockford makes low wattage sub's??? Lol. I assumed it was one of the big ones. Even at 300w though you could have rattle.

The quality of your amp will most definitely have an effect on your sound. Look for amps that are CEA-2006 compliant. This means they have been tested by a third party to meet the specifics the manufacturer is claiming it can. ie RMS, peak wattage, SNR, crossover freq etc
Interesting, good to know. It sucks though, because I sold that setup and now I don't know if it was the sub size or the amp that made the difference :P
And yeah... RF makes tons of low wattage woofers, just use the filter on the side: http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/products/selector/mobile-subwoofers/punch%C2%AE-subwoofers

[Dubwize]

I'm a Kicker L7 kind of guy. Damn those dual voice coil L7s pound.

[DLYDRVN]

If you have an OEM Bose system, you have two choices:

-LOC with sub amp and sub as described above.
-Rip the whole thing out and do it all from scratch.

There are few if any decks that interface with the OEM Bose stuff because the Bose 'audio modules' work on some weird logic signalling for power and control.

You _could_ just replace the deck and run wiring into the doors for the stock bose speakers, but the drivers have weird crossover design points and you probably won't have the best sound. SOME of the bose systems actually bi amp, or do some really weird configuration things (Like the RX8 that runs speaker level to the tweeter, then pulls high level signal from that to run an amp mounted to the mid-bass speaker frame assy... It's feckin weird..)

Also, I don't know what Bose speakers trulanken has seen in our cars, maybe gen2 is different (although i doubt it) but the Bose speakers they use in OEM applications are cheap paper cone drivers paired with Neodymium magnets.. Hardly top shelf drivers. The stock mazda2 system has that. And that stupid little plastic thing that can only charitably be called a 'sub' under the passenger seat is basically just a high excursion 4" mid-bass to sort of fill in the bottom. Paired with a sub you're gonna get nothing but mud around 100hz-200hz. So i'd rip that out or at least unplug it if you add a sub to the stock system.

There is also absolutely nothing wrong with upgrading the front speakers and leaving the rears alone. The fronts will _ALWAYS_ be more capable and likely more efficient than the OEM rear speakers, and so no matter how loud you play your music, it's likely that unless your amp is dramatically overpowered you won't harm the rears at all. plus if you just 'fade' forward a little on the deck, you can draw power away from the rears to protect them. Double that if you have a proper deck with crossover control.

[Dubwize]

If you have an OEM Bose system, you have two choices:

-LOC with sub amp and sub as described above.
-Rip the whole thing out and do it all from scratch.

There are few if any decks that interface with the OEM Bose stuff because the Bose 'audio modules' work on some weird logic signalling for power and control.

You _could_ just replace the deck and run wiring into the doors for the stock bose speakers, but the drivers have weird crossover design points and you probably won't have the best sound. SOME of the bose systems actually bi amp, or do some really weird configuration things (Like the RX8 that runs speaker level to the tweeter, then pulls high level signal from that to run an amp mounted to the mid-bass speaker frame assy... It's feckin weird..)

Also, I don't know what Bose speakers trulanken has seen in our cars, maybe gen2 is different (although i doubt it) but the Bose speakers they use in OEM applications are cheap paper cone drivers paired with Neodymium magnets.. Hardly top shelf drivers. The stock mazda2 system has that. And that stupid little plastic thing that can only charitably be called a 'sub' under the passenger seat is basically just a high excursion 4" mid-bass to sort of fill in the bottom. Paired with a sub you're gonna get nothing but mud around 100hz-200hz. So i'd rip that out or at least unplug it if you add a sub to the stock system.

There is also absolutely nothing wrong with upgrading the front speakers and leaving the rears alone. The fronts will _ALWAYS_ be more capable and likely more efficient than the OEM rear speakers, and so no matter how loud you play your music, it's likely that unless your amp is dramatically overpowered you won't harm the rears at all. plus if you just 'fade' forward a little on the deck, you can draw power away from the rears to protect them. Double that if you have a proper deck with crossover control.


The OEM Bose stuff on the gen2's is just as bad, yes, technically better then the non-Bose but still nowhere close to even low end after market stuff.

What i'm saying is if you're not going to change out anything other then the two front door speakers. "Most" people will tend to turn the stereo up more, since the fronts can now produce much higher non-distorted sound then the crappy rears can, you can/may cause issues. Like I said you won't blow them, but if you're driving the rears at or near peak you could add noise that will distract from the overall sound quality. Yes you have the ability to fade forward so as to not cause extra noise issues. Now if you are changing out more then just speakers, adding an amp, and/or a HU. Then yeah feel free to do just the fronts. Aftermarket gear has way more features that allow you to tune the sound to exactly what you want.

Just to add, I think rear door speakers are pretty useless anyways. they drive sound into the rear footwells which is ridicules. yes they are more aesthetically pleasing but horrible sound-wise.

[jaimie08mazda3]

Well I learned something about the bose system today. It makes sense though as my brother has the Bose system for his 09 TSX and we just put MTX 6.5s in the front and Infinity in the rears. They were flimsy and just terrible. Aftermarket will almost always sound better (if you buy sony car audio your gonna have a bad time). I've put Clarions all the way around my doors and they are really nice for my mids and highs (they are also amplified) but for the lows I really wouldn't use just them and be fine with it. Go buy yourself a 10" with a 500W amp and call it a day. I saw you were looking at only spending 300 as to when I said 500. But then again to me go big or go home haha. But for 300 you can get a 10" with a 500W amp no problem and be happy with that if your not looking for overkill like myself. Keep on the lookout on Kijiji and car audio shops themselves have a lot of sales as well. And seeing as how you don't intend to put a deck in you will also have to use a LOC to run it which sucks when you want to adjust the bass level on the sub. The sound with the aftermarket deck also makes a huuuge difference. I hope this helps as I've gone through a few different setups (5 years with a LOC too).

[ice512]

Thanks for all the suggestions. After reading all the posts and speaking with a forum sponsor, it looks like replacing speakers isn't the answer at all.

I am mostly like going to get the Bazooka sub&amp tub for free (by using gift cards), and have one of the sponsors install it for me professionally.

[Dubwize]

Free is always good.

[jaimie08mazda3]

That it is. Bazooka tubes are cool. The fusion ones are really cool and actually can hit pretty good. I saw a set at Powerline a while ago and it was a 12" with a 500W amp for like 300.

[Default User]

I've always liked the look of the NOS Bottle Bazooka tubes

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/08/25/c8c929e491d380a9cb091ed189c9212c.jpg

[trulankan]

I've always liked the look of the NOS Bottle Bazooka tubes

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/08/25/c8c929e491d380a9cb091ed189c9212c.jpg

wow really lol nice

[jaimie08mazda3]

Those NOS bottles are awesome. This is the one I was thinking of. http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd68/jaimiemazda08/cs-at1100_500x375.png

[ice512]

http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/bazooka-bazooka-10-amplified-bass-tube-subwoofer-bta10100rbc-bta10100rbc/10182188.aspx?path=686187b92f65b3e7e79f7da925919f5 fen02

Any feedback on this specific Bazooka guys?

[jaimie08mazda3]

Hmm simple and somewhat effective. Is it bad that I have triple the power running to my door speakers? Lol! But all in all for the sound your looking for that does look like a good idea. Its small so you can get stuff into your trunk, easy to mount and the reviews I read were pretty good. And for 120 you can't really go wrong. Funny thing is to get it professionally installed will probably run you close to what your paying for the sub itself lol.

[ice512]

Funny thing is to get it professionally installed will probably run you close to what your paying for the sub itself lol.

That is very true...lol
Luckily I have some gift cards that I can utilize....

[Default User]

IIRC - the Bazooka already has the required wiring (LOC, power, ground and remote)

(Well - at least it did back in the day....)

Should be a straight forward DIY install.

[jaimie08mazda3]

IIRC - the Bazooka already has the required wiring (LOC, power, ground and remote)

(Well - at least it did back in the day....)

Should be a straight forward DIY install.

Pretty certain it does too. But still for a LOC you do have to tap into the door speakers which some people aren't comfortable with.

[ice512]

Pretty certain it does too. But still for a LOC you do have to tap into the door speakers which some people aren't comfortable with.

hmm not 100% sure what that means, but i'm paying a reputable sponsor on the forum to do the job for me. if it's something that will cause major problems down the road (ie blowing the speakers) I'm confident they will warn me before they carry on with the installation.

[jaimie08mazda3]

Well basically with a setup that's going to a stock deck you need to put in a LOC (line output converter) in for the RCAs so what you end up having to do is tap into the rear door speakers and wire them to the LOC which will send the Right and Left signal to the amp. I actually have a write up stickied on this section on how to do it. Mind you its for my Gen 1 but I'm pretty sure the wires are still the same. I went aftermarket after about 5 years of using a LOC.

[ice512]

Well basically with a setup that's going to a stock deck you need to put in a LOC (line output converter) in for the RCAs so what you end up having to do is tap into the rear door speakers and wire them to the LOC which will send the Right and Left signal to the amp. I actually have a write up stickied on this section on how to do it. Mind you its for my Gen 1 but I'm pretty sure the wires are still the same. I went aftermarket after about 5 years of using a LOC.

ok thanks, and this is not something that will overload and blow my stock speakers right? how come it's not needed to tap into the front speakers also?

[jaimie08mazda3]

I'm not actually too certain why not. I guess technically you could but its easier using the rears. I never had an issue. No you will never overpower the speakers and have them blow. Its only taking the signal from the deck to the speakers.

[Dubwize]

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the Bose system have a small 4(6) channel amp under the front passenger seat, I'm sure it be easier to tap the lines coming out of that for the LOC. Also it won't matter which speakers you tap (front or rear) just make sure to use one left and one right and don't tap into the center speaker or the other rear speakers, from what I have seen those extra two speakers the Bose system has in the back are running in parallel and therefore are a mono output.

[DLYDRVN]

The oroblem is that those outputs from the bose system may already be crossed over. You need to make sure you tap the low-mids if thats the case

[Dubwize]

Good call, I'm sure they have had some signal processing done to them. The stock headunit sends 4 channels to the amp, the amp then creates the extra 2 channels, both of which are mono. If you're looking for the cleanest non-processed signal it would be those lines into the amp I'm guessing.

[ice512]

Picked it up today and getting it installed tmr. Kinda nervous...:blush

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o49/Ice512/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_192711_zps07597b34.jpg (http://s117.photobucket.com/user/Ice512/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_192711_zps07597b34.jpg.html)

[Cab0oze]

Picked it up today and getting it installed tmr. Kinda nervous...:blush

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o49/Ice512/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_192711_zps07597b34.jpg (http://s117.photobucket.com/user/Ice512/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_192711_zps07597b34.jpg.html)
Lol you're having someone install it for you and you're nervous??


hmm not 100% sure what that means, but i'm paying a reputable sponsor on the forum to do the job for me. if it's something that will cause major problems down the road (ie blowing the speakers) I'm confident they will warn me before they carry on with the installation.

Lol man you crack me up :P
You cannot blow your speakers by installing a LOC.

[ice512]

lol nervous as in I don't know how the sound is gonna turn out...I've never done any mod to any stereo before...lol

[murdaspeed]

I disconnected my Bose sub and hooked up my LOC to the subwoofer harness in the trunk, then mounted the amp on the back of the back seat and powered to the battery. Works beautifully and simple to do. I bought one of those NOS subwoofers years ago, don't really know what I was thinking. But since removed the woofer from the bottle, lol, and put it in a band pass box. This is the setup i'm currently using. Pounds very good for an 8".

[jaimie08mazda3]

lol nervous as in I don't know how the sound is gonna turn out...I've never done any mod to any stereo before...lol
Lol as Cab0oze said you really have no worries. Its only going to sound better then it did before. Being that its only an 8" bazooka tube its not going to overpower your whole system. But it will give a nice punch to what you have now.

[ice512]

Lol as Cab0oze said you really have no worries. Its only going to sound better then it did before. Being that its only an 8" bazooka tube its not going to overpower your whole system. But it will give a nice punch to what you have now.

Got it installed yesterday and I like it when it works. It's the perfect amount of bass at approx. half the output and there is no rattling license plate or windows.

HOWEVER, there is a small problem though. There is delayed response. For example, when I first turn on the radio and there is a song playing, the first 5-10 seconds would have no sub activation. The sub would kick in after.
When I am trying to stream music via BT or USB, I sometimes don't get subwoofer activation until halfway through the chorus. The beats would be dead on but the sub will not activate right away. However if i loop that song over again, it would be completely fine. :S:S

[Dubwize]

Is it only when the car first started up, or for it go out if you switch CDs or change to Bluetooth streaming?

[jaimie08mazda3]

Got it installed yesterday and I like it when it works. It's the perfect amount of bass at approx. half the output and there is no rattling license plate or windows.

HOWEVER, there is a small problem though. There is delayed response. For example, when I first turn on the radio and there is a song playing, the first 5-10 seconds would have no sub activation. The sub would kick in after.
When I am trying to stream music via BT or USB, I sometimes don't get subwoofer activation until halfway through the chorus. The beats would be dead on but the sub will not activate right away. However if i loop that song over again, it would be completely fine. :S:S
That is strange. Maybe it just takes a few seconds to kick in and when your listening to it low it barely kicks in. I've never heard of this before. My advice is turn on the car play some music and watch and see what the amp is doing. Something could be off about the wiring.

[ice512]

That is strange. Maybe it just takes a few seconds to kick in and when your listening to it low it barely kicks in. I've never heard of this before. My advice is turn on the car play some music and watch and see what the amp is doing. Something could be off about the wiring.

I googled "subwoofer delayed response" and actually found quite a bit of info on it. It might have to deal with the fact that the sub is not getting enough bass signal to activate since it is on "auto on" right now. Afterall I do listen to pretty soft music.

I'm going to bring it back on Thursday and have it set to "always on" mode to see if it helps.

[ice512]

Is it only when the car first started up, or for it go out if you switch CDs or change to Bluetooth streaming?

It happens constantly, when I first start up the car, first start up a song, first time I play a song etc...
The sub would activate in and out during chorus.

[Dubwize]

Yeah set it to always on, and make sure the power is coming from an ignition source. So it doesn't drain the battery when the car is off.

[jaimie08mazda3]

I googled "subwoofer delayed response" and actually found quite a bit of info on it. It might have to deal with the fact that the sub is not getting enough bass signal to activate since it is on "auto on" right now. Afterall I do listen to pretty soft music.

I'm going to bring it back on Thursday and have it set to "always on" mode to see if it helps.

Auto on? I didn't even know there was such a thing lol. But yea set it to always on. if your listening to "soft" music (not sure on what that entails haha) and its not really loud then I would assume it wouldn't trigger anything because there isn't enough bass for it to want to turn on.

[ice512]

Yeah set it to always on, and make sure the power is coming from an ignition source. So it doesn't drain the battery when the car is off.

Yeh thats what he said...he said he will create a wire and hook it up to the engine. So when the engine is on the sub is on..

[ice512]

Auto on? I didn't even know there was such a thing lol. But yea set it to always on. if your listening to "soft" music (not sure on what that entails haha) and its not really loud then I would assume it wouldn't trigger anything because there isn't enough bass for it to want to turn on.

lol...soft music...I'm Chinese, so chinese pop songs, mostly slow ones...nothing rock or heavy metal...

[jaimie08mazda3]

So its almost like you don't need more bass haha. I listen to Rock, Rap, EDM and all that involves lots and lots of bass. But hopefully they get that solved. The only way I know how to turn off my stereo is unhook the RCAs haha. Or well the quickest way anyhow.

[Ex-Rolla]

I wouldnt bother replacing the in car speakers.

What i did for my 2010 Speed 3 (no longer have it), was simply install a LOC (a good one that is plug and play, like the PAC-Audio (http://www.pac-audio.com/) one), and run that to my amp/sub.

I was extremely happy with the sound

edit: Just realized i'm late in replying to this thread :)