Random MS3 Chat Thread

[Fobio]

For those of you too lazy to search for a topic or just want to shoot the sh!t about MS3...here you go!

This thread shall serve as the defacto offline "informal MS3 chat" over the winter season...

I'll organize another "Informal MS3 Chat" meet after the new year.

Remember, if you have something meaningful to ask or contribute, it's best to start a new thread so others or yourself can easily search for it in the future...these "catch-all" threads are difficult to search through and info may get lost...

So in the meantime, between now and our next meet, ask you questions here...

[chrismelito]

Gas?

I dunno, I've read so much about gas, but there doesn't really seem to be a consensus on Pioneer 91 octane gas. I know that a lot of people are beholden to the Shell 94, but I'm wondering if anyone has had any actual bad experiences with Pioneer 91? Is it actually supplied by Sunoco, or no? I have a Pioneer very close to the house, use it for all my BBQ propane needs, and the Bonus Bucks thing is pretty awesome. I've gone through one tank of the gas the dealership put in, and just filled it with the Pioneer to give it a shot. No big deal, what do you guys think?

[Elusivellama]

While we're on the topic of gas... how about Canadian Tire Gas bar 91 octane? The 87 octane is good to my regular Mazda, hoping the 91 will prove to be as good. The reason why I mention this is because I can save anywhere from 2cts to 10cts per litre depending on how much I spend on a billing cycle on my Cdn Tire mastercard, always a minimum 2cts savings at all times. Obviously I don't overspend to get the higher gas discount, but I do look for ways to put expenses on the card so I can reach the next tier (buying stuff for a family member, etc).

(yes, I did also read that people swear by Sunoco 94, now sold by Petro Canada I believe?)

[horto]

Y'all splurged for the turbo zoom zoom, splurge and feed your new baby some quality fuel?

[Elusivellama]

Y'all splurged for the turbo zoom zoom, splurge and feed your new baby some quality fuel?

such a slippery slope. Can you describe the diff. between regular 91 and sunoco 94, in feel of the car?

[horto]

No. That's why god invented search buttons!



My point is not about feel, but about care and feeding of a quality piece of machinery. Those of us that are passionate about our cars are passionate about what fluids and fuel we put into them.
No offense, but I wouldn't put Canadian Tire gas into ANY car that I own...

Would you feed your own child discount baby formula? Hells no!

[Elusivellama]

91 Shell cannot be compressed as much as 94 before pre-detonation occurs hence the engine senses detonation and runs in safe mode and dumps excess fuel to lower cylinder tempreture and prevent pre-detonation. Hence more fuel that can possibly be burnt while running in safe mode and out onto back of car!!! 94 octance can be compressed and does not pre-detonate prior to top dead centre does not run in safe mode all fuel is burnt when spark fires at TDC,(top dead centre) hence no unburnt fuel on back of car only slight soot on tailpipes.

Something like this? Found it with searching on google.

[Kinn]

Something like this? Found it with searching on google.

I believe that's called knock. Higher octane prevents the fuel mix from igniting due to high compression before being fired buy the plugs. That's all that higher octane does...prevents, knock. My understanding is that unless you are tuning the car, the motor and fuel system is designed to run with minimal knock on 91. I'm not really sure that you get any benefit from 94 unless you tune for it. I'm guessing the stock ECM won't make enough of a timing adjustment to really add power.

But I could be wrong...

[JStroke]

No. That's why god invented search buttons!



My point is not about feel, but about care and feeding of a quality piece of machinery. Those of us that are passionate about our cars are passionate about what fluids and fuel we put into them.
No offense, but I wouldn't put Canadian Tire gas into ANY car that I own...

Would you feed your own child discount baby formula? Hells no!

Where does Canadian Tire get their gas? I was under the impression that there are 4 refineries that it may have come from in Ontario, by 3 different companies. They don't make their own gas. What is the issue with CT gas? I have always liked it.

[chrismelito]

Firstly, I'd like to point out that I did do a search of both the internet and this forum to find out if there was any specific, complete, verifiable information on Pioneer gas in the Mazdaspeed 3. Neither search provided the information I was looking for, and most from this forum referred to Pioneer electronics. What little mentions there were on Pioneer gas products referred to information that was either incomplete or not specific to the MS3.

Second, I have no issue whatsoever spending extra money on gas. I don't find gas prices to be expensive in North America, as I'm fully aware that we pay significantly less than most other places in the world. I have zero problem with the extra money involved in paying for 94 octane vs. 91 octane gas. However, I don't have a convenient station near to me, so if Pioneer 91 has been deemed completely acceptable by a fair number of MS3 drivers, I'm more than happy to purchase that gas. However, because Pioneer stations are few and far between, I'm not surprised that there is a small amount of information.

If it needs to be Sunoco 94 gas, and Pennzoil Premium/Ultra oil, and whatever brake/tranny/whatever fluid, that's what I'm going to buy. But if there's no measurable difference then I just don't see the point in going well out of my way to get the 94.

So, I wonder, is there any information that you guys have on Pioneer specifically, or is it too small a statistical sample size to know? If yes to the second part of the question then I will err on the side of caution and go the extra distance for the Sunoco Ultra 94.

To quote Zoom Zoom Boy "My car does not like Shell 91 octane fuel and other MS3 owners have also concurred with this. Then again, plenty run Shell 91 and swear by it, but to each their own." That doesn't sound conclusive to me, but I am more than happy to bow to the forum's significant experience.

[Fobio]

The closest gas station to Cayuga is a Pioneer...unless I'm on fumes LEAVING the track, I'd never fill there...and if I do, it'll be just enough to get to a petro/sunocco...

I think the very fact that you don't see/hear anyone using Pioneer for the MS3 or have written any glowing reviews about Pioneer speaks volumes about its use with the MS3.

having ssaid that, I need to state that I'm not pointing out that this or that gas is no good...all I'm saying is that there is overwhelming evidence that Ultra 94 is best for this car, esp when tuned...

stock guys wouldn't feel a diff between 91 and 94...and I dare anyone to prove me wrong on a track/dyno.

[laksman91]

I don't see what the hype is about 94 Octane when your car is made from the factory to run on 91. Unless your tune requires 94, don't see why not 91. I personally run V-Power 91 all the time, and if I'm too lazy to find a Shell, I use the PetroCan 94

[Fobio]

I also wouldn't drive like 10 km out of the way to get gas tho...lol...but getting gas could be "habit forming" in this car...so in the past couple of moves, one of the first thing I looked for was a gas stn/dealer with Ultra...I know I have three near me, and more importantly, I also know all the ones that don't...haha...

if you're not in the city, getting one stn to another costs more than a litre of gas, then I'd say, it's not worth it...but I might also alter my routes a bit to allow me to get my personal preference of gas...

even tuned, I sometimes run Petro/Esso/Shell 91 when I know I'm not going to be pushing my car into the rpm ranges where I have advanced timing.

[chrismelito]

I guess I'll find some 94 for my next fill-up, and see if I notice any difference. I'm probably not going to do any modifications to the car until it stops being my daily driver, so maybe it's a moot point for now.

I didn't want to confuse things, or raise anyone's ire, so thanks everyone for all your input.

[Fobio]

I guess I'll find some 94 for my next fill-up, and see if I notice any difference. I'm probably not going to do any modifications to the car until it stops being my daily driver, so maybe it's a moot point for now.

I didn't want to confuse things, or raise anyone's ire, so thanks everyone for all your input.

hey man...it's the random chat...put your legs up and get to know the personalities behind the words...=)

we didn't get this car cuz we're generally agreeable...and another reason to chk out the scene on mazdaspeedforums.org for a wider perspective.

[chrismelito]

Argh! Too many forums!

[MajesticBlueNTO]

hey man...it's the random chat...put your legs up and get to know the personalities behind the words...=)

we didn't get this car cuz we're generally agreeable...and another reason to chk out the scene on mazdaspeedforums.org for a wider perspective.

Argh! Too many forums!

you'll need to grow some thick skin to surf, let alone post, on msf.org

as for gas, i ran Shell 91 for 7 months, and the previous owner put nothing but Shell 91 in the car ...it ran fine both stock and on the cobb stg1 91 tune.

[horto]

+1

As I've said in other posts: I prefer to run Shell V-power 91 with a 91 octane tune (on my Cobb AP) for daily driving (commuting), because in *my* car, I get better gas mileage that way. Track days and summer I run Ultra 94 with a 94 octane tune whenever possible.

Problem is, I don't have a Sunoco anywhere near me. But I do have a Shell on my way home from work. So I balance convenience with performance. (And tune accordingly).

Back to my original point, my car gets Sunoco/Petro 94 or Shell 91. Nothing else. Esso if I'm really desperate. Nothing less than that.

Now, stock was a different story. I got super shit gas mileage with Ultra 94. When I got mods and the AP, the 94 octane tune made my gas mileage better (plus performance, higher boost targets, butt dyno, etc). If I was stock I wouldn't bother with the 94 octane, just Shell V-power 91. But every car is different... I even notice a huge difference between my '07 and Acechikita's 07. Same car, same year, relatively close manufacturer's dates, but totally different beasts. Can't really explain it other than nuances.

What I would suggest is run through a few different kinds of gas. Get a full tank at a time, measure your mileage with the trip odometer and see how the car feels. As you get to know the car, you'll get a feel for what it likes and what it doesn't...

I also wouldn't drive like 10 km out of the way to get gas tho...lol...but getting gas could be "habit forming" in this car...so in the past couple of moves, one of the first thing I looked for was a gas stn/dealer with Ultra...I know I have three near me, and more importantly, I also know all the ones that don't...haha...

if you're not in the city, getting one stn to another costs more than a litre of gas, then I'd say, it's not worth it...but I might also alter my routes a bit to allow me to get my personal preference of gas...

even tuned, I sometimes run Petro/Esso/Shell 91 when I know I'm not going to be pushing my car into the rpm ranges where I have advanced timing.

[PR3Y11]

i've only had to get one fill up so far since the dealer, which was probably running it on 91, i normally use ultra and have gotten used to pumping that, but surprisingly i haven't noticed much of a difference in this car except for the terrible fuel ecom but that's not really something i didn't expect.
also a random note and seek a little advise:
i'm thinking of getting a new set of rims+tires for spring/summer, my stock speed rims and tires are still brand new (never driven on yet), should i try and sell those off or should i just hold on to them, with the old speed, the rims look pretty nice, but i don't really like the look of the new ones so powder coating them isn't really an option i want to take.
as for rims i'll just end up picking out whatever it is that i like, but i need some help with the tires. any suggestions?

[laksman91]

For tires, since you have a dedicated winter set, I would go with a straight summer set instead of an All-Season.

Pros: Awesome grip, handling
Cons: Greater wear you'd need to replace them more

Some good ones are Dunlop Star-Specs, Hankook RS-3, Yokohama AD08 - the Dunlop being the general bang for the buck tire. These are on the more aggressive end of the spectrum. You can go for a milder set like the Hankook V12 and still get awesome grip. Personally, I'm getting meself a set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cups - I don't drive the car all that much so I can deal with the wear.

MBNTO and Fobio should have good info on tires

[Elusivellama]

Since we're talking about gas and there are a couple other new MS3 owners in here aside from myself, I expect that we'll see break-in fuel economy (ex. 13 - 14L/100km or worse) until the car is ready to play nice, probably due in part to the whole 'varying speeds' break-in procedure along with occasional mid-open throttles. That's something I'll have to remember when I'm cruising on the highway, I tend to go about 110 these days and let all the faster drivers go ahead and trigger all the speed traps for me Do you think it's a good idea to bring it up to around 5000 or even 5500 rpm on occasion, to let the car experience a higher rev range than normal DD rpm range? I know the manual says not to go WOT in break-in, especially not WOT starts, so I was planning on doing a downshift at highway speeds to a safe gear while letting off the throttle, stay there for about 5 seconds or so while allowing the car to rev up to that range, then go back to normal highway driving. If this is the wrong thing to do, let me know.

[starscream]

Does anyone know if Pioneer changed gas suppliers/refineries?

I say this because I am suspected to believe that maybe Pioneer uses the same refinery as Sunoco/Petro Canada. Remember back in the day they (Pioneer) carried the "MAGNUM 94" gas? It wasnt at all stations but I remember them having it. Given right now the only supplier is Sunoco/PetroCanada that has 94, it could have been from the same refinery? I dunno just a thought.

Personally I use Sunoco 94 (My strategy is if you use your points you can get a 5cent off per litre card (for 200L) for 6000 points, so use that and the gas effectively becomes cheap as 91) and luckily theres a Sunoco/Petro that has 94 2 minutes from my house. If I am in dire needs I get Shell 91. Its maybe in my head but I get better mileage with Shell 91 (maybe lack of ethonol in their 91? I dunno).

[PR3Y11]

For tires, since you have a dedicated winter set, I would go with a straight summer set instead of an All-Season.

Pros: Awesome grip, handling
Cons: Greater wear you'd need to replace them more

Some good ones are Dunlop Star-Specs, Hankook RS-3, Yokohama AD08 - the Dunlop being the general bang for the buck tire. These are on the more aggressive end of the spectrum. You can go for a milder set like the Hankook V12 and still get awesome grip. Personally, I'm getting meself a set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cups - I don't drive the car all that much so I can deal with the wear.

MBNTO and Fobio should have good info on tires

Thanks for the pointers I'll definitely look into those tires. I was lookin at the Toyota t1r and it seems to have some good reviews any input on those?

[Fobio]

Thanks for the pointers I'll definitely look into those tires. I was lookin at the Toyota t1r and it seems to have some good reviews any input on those?

I wouldn't buy Toyota tires, even if they made them...they might not stop. EL OH EL

Hankook V12's...they're the best bang-for-buck tires out there...a great number of positive reviews on msf.org. Great in the rain...amazing price...other than a softer than normal side-wall, they're better than the Falken 615's or Nitto 555's that I have ran before.

[laksman91]

Lol, Toyota.. The Toyo T1Rs are priced pretty high if I remember correctly - probably better options at that price range.